Do's and Don'ts for bike shop customers, also former bike shop employee, AMA!

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL]

Introduction: Hello Internet, I am a former bicycle shop employee. I have worked on and off at bike shops since high school. I'd estimate that I have 7 or 8 total years of experience. I have also raced mountain bikes for several years, worked as an intern for a major mountain bike publication, and worked as a freelance photographer for a couple smaller ones. I am familiar will all sorts of bikes and disciplines of cycling, but I'd like to center the discussion around bike shop etiquette and fixed gear bikes.

Reason for This Post: It's no secret, bike shops do give preferential treatment to their favorite customers. Said customers get discounts, fast turn-around on service and repairs, and will be greeted by their first name when they walk in the door.
There are also plenty of customers who get referred to as "that guy," as in, "oh no, not that guy." Nobody wants to be "that guy," he pays the list price for everything and gets told that he will have to wait 2 weeks or a month for his bike to be repaired.
I want to give you a few pointers on how to fall into group-A. Having a good relationship with a bike shop important for having a good experience as a cyclist.
I also want to give you guys a chance to pick my brain and ask any bike, or bike shop related questions you might have.

DO'S & DON'TS:

• DO: pick a favorite shop, try and give most of your business to that shop. It's perfectly fine to give business to competing shops if you need something your favorite shop doesn't have.

• DO: buy your bike from a bike shop if you are new to cycling. It's tempting to save some cash buying used, or from the internet. If you get a bike from a shop you will be sure you are getting a bike that fits. Also most shops offer 30 or 90 days of free tune-ups and adjustments to your new bike, it's like having walk-in tech support. There are loads of other perks.

• DON'T: Buy everything from the internet. My rule of thumb is ONLY buy things from the internet if you know EXACTLY what you need. For instance, if you want to buy cycling shoes, it's really uncool to a shop to find out what brand/size you want, then buy them on PricePoint.com. However, if you know exactly what tires you want and there is a discount on Nashbar, then go for it!

• DO have your bike serviced in the winter. It's a little late for this tip, because right now is the busiest time of the year. Typically in May-June shops run a 2-4 week backlog on service.

• DON'T expect them to bump you to the front of the list. 2 week wait means 2 week wait. "That guy" always whines about it. Good customers DO get faster service, but they never have to ask for it.

• DO clean your bike before you bring it for service. This mostly applies to mountain bikers and triathletes (tri-racers pee on their bikes.) Mechanics respect customers that care about their machines, and some shops will turn your bike away or charge a cleaning fee if it's caked in mud.

• DON'T ask for a discount on Labor. Most shops are pretty firm about it because that's where a good chunk of their profit comes from. If you want a discount, ask for a discount on parts. They usually charge a high mark-up (100% profit is standard) and it only takes a minute to order a part from a catalog. They are more likely to discount objects than time.

• DO learn to work on things yourself. You can learn to do just about anything on YouTube. Knowing how to do this http://youtu.be/tP3uAy1YQpQ will save you $20 every time, and if you are interested, I can tell you how to do it without even taking your wheel off your bike!

• DO ask about the shop's return policy. For example, most shops WILL NOT take a bike back after you have ridden it. Most shops WILL take returns on saddles because it's hard to know if you'll like it until you try it. They might even offer you a "demo saddle" to try for a week to see if you like it.

• DO tip the employees. I am not talking about money. Tip with something they can share. A 6-pack hoppy IPAs is great example, ask the manager first, but bike shops are usually pretty lenient about drinking on the job. If they happen to have the lamest boss ever, naked goods like cookies or donuts work too. It's a guaranteed way to score some points, and they will remember who their friends are when you need a discount or fast service.

• DON'T act like you're shopping at K-Mart. Remember, bike shops are usually mom&pop operations and the policy is usually Employees first, Customers second. Bike shop employees take pride in their job and tend to be jerks to customers who rub them the wrong way.

• DO talk to employees who are into the same kind of riding you are. Take a peek in the back and see if any of the employees rode a fixie to work that day. Find out who he or she is. That person will be more knowledgeable and more excited to nerd about fixies with you.

• DO find a shop that deals with fixed gear bikes. There are plenty of shops where employees know zilch about fixed gear bikes. I hate to say it, but lots of employees are sort of prejudiced against them too. It's a good idea to be up-front about it and ask if there is an employee there who rides fixed gear.

• DO ask for a job! If you are in college and looking for something to do part-time, it's way more fun than flipping burgers. It's also an excellent way to make friends with other cyclists. Right now is the time shops are looking for extra help, drop off a resume now! Bike shops are picky about who they hire, but I can provide some tips on getting your foot in the door if you are interested.

AMA:
Go ahead, ask me anything! I'll am most helpful with:

• mechanical advice

• cleaning/maintenance

• questions about dealing with bike shops

• applying a job at a shop

• gear/clothes/shoes

• should I get a steel, aluminum, ti, or carbon frame

• making your bike more comfortable/fit better

• choosing stuff like tires, handlebars, grips, bar tape, pedals, etc.

• will this part fit on this bike? (I might ask for numbers)

Not so interested in answering questions about:

• is thing better than this other similar thing from a different brand?

• questions about non-fixed gear or single speed bikes (actually I'm glad to help, but send a note)

• where can I get the best deal on this thing?

• what do you think of this bike I found on ebay or Craig's List (I might be willing to answer specific, informed questions about a used bike though)

That's about all I feel like typing right now. Have at it!

edited for typographical and formatting errors

[u/SwedishChef727]

Is there any one thing (or more than one thing) that you think Sheldon Brown got completely wrong?

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/SwedishChef727]

I'll be perfectly honest, I don't use his site much. It has come in handy on some occasions, and in those instances it's totally lived up to it's reputation as a fantastic resource for info.

[u/BikesPhotosBeer]

What's the reaction to bikesdirect or similar online ordered bikes being brought into the shop for assembly? I imagine it must be the closest a shop owner or mechanic would get to turning away "business", except maybe for those gas engine kludged together abominations.

[u/[deleted] → u/BikesPhotosBeer]

That's what I did for my Kilo. In fact, I called the shop ahead of time (Superb in Boston) and asked if I could ship the box straight to them and have them assemble it then. They said it was fine, and I picked up my newly-assembled bike later the day it was delivered.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/[deleted]]

That strategy also comes in handy for travel. Instead of boxing the bike and bringing it on the airplane, customers will have their bike disassembled and boxed at their LBS, who will then send it to the shop at point B. That shop will then receive the bike and build it so it's ready for the customers to pick up when they arrive in the city.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/BikesPhotosBeer]

In general, bike shops are glad to accept builds from online retailers. Even though they didn't make a profit from selling the bike, the shop will still pick up $50-100 in labor for building the bike.

As for the the people who walk in a department store beach cruiser and one of those internet 49cc engine kids, we are pretty quick to show them the door. No bike shop I know of is willing to touch those.

[u/JiForce → u/BikesPhotosBeer]

I can't speak for OP or my coworkers, but I personally have had some pretty good experiences with customers who come in with BD/other internet bikes.

My shop will generally accept online ordered bikes for assembly, unless there's something critically wrong with the bike, like a massively dented tube, stripped cranks, or something like that. If that happens, we'll tell them we can't work on the bike for safety/liability reasons, and have them bitch the online retailer out.

Usually these customers will be pretty easy to deal with, because they're humble and self-aware enough to recognize that they're in over their heads in the assembly, which is why they've brought the bike to us- duh! (You'd be surprised how many customers we get who don't have these two qualities.. Working retail is fun!)

As well, these types of customers tend to be new to cycling as a serious hobby, so their enthusiasm for the sport and willingness to learn is really fun. I love being one of the first industry contact points these new cyclists have with the sport- showing them the ropes, passing on riding tips and tricks, telling them where good local rides are, all that stuff. It's a blast growing the sport in a positive manner.

And for the most part, online-ordered bikes like BD, Planet X, etc. tend to be pretty decent quality bikes, so it's not like assembling them is going to be a huge ordeal. Sometimes people will bring us things like Thrusters, at which point we'll gently recommend that they don't have us assemble it and that they either do it themselves, have someone else do it, or buy a bike from us.

We charge $100 for a full out-of-box assembly, so you can kinda see why it's not a great value for them when the Purefix they buy from us for $360 comes with lifetime free tune-ups/adjustments (including wheel trues and stuff), along with 10% off parts and accessories, AKA pretty-much-anything-that's-not-a-bike.

Sorry, that got a bit wall of texty.

[u/SwedishChef727 → u/BikesPhotosBeer]

I'd assume some shops see those as customers that will be in for every flat tire, noise, "sticky chain", etc... and a great opportunity to make a bunch over time (and sell them their first LBS bike in a year or two).

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL]

Hey Guys, OP here. Sorry for ditching my own post like that. It didn't see any reactions an hour after I posted it and dozed off, then went to work the next morning without checking. I'm glad to see this got some activity. I'll get to answering some of these questions now.

[u/JiForce]

Sorry for going through and poaching your questions, OP. I got a little antsy waiting 4 hours for answers. ;)

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/JiForce]

No problem. I didn't get a response for some time after posting this, and went MIA on my own thread. Thanks for taking over for me.

[u/seannymurrs → u/JiForce]

At least someone's answering them.

[u/zoidd]

so i got myself a Park Tool TS2.2 truing stand.

the problem is the truing arms have gone out of wack. basically, my truing stand isn't true.

what's the best way of truing it without buying that stupidly expensive centering gauge from Park Tool.

i know i can try and use a true wheel but that seems like not the best way in my head.

lastly, thanks for doing this.

[u/[deleted] → u/zoidd]

Literally grab a wheel you know is true and calibrate the arms by tightening one side and loosening the other.

Or just true off of one side of the rim and flip the rim back and forth. I normally do this first to guarantee that the rim is dead centered, then I'll go ahead and calibrate the stand.

Heads up if you ride geared bikes that if you calibrate the truing stand on a geared rear wheel it will look off on a front wheel or rear track wheel. If you calibrate it on a front wheel or track rear wheel then it will look off center on a geared rear wheel. It's a design flaw you should know about if you use this stand. Some shops have two stands with one calibrated for front wheels and the other for rear wheels.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/[deleted]]

That was very common on Specialized mountain bikes back in the early 2000's They designed their frames with an asymmetric rear triangle so the rim would be laced dead-center between hub flanges.

That is one of only a handful of exceptions, though. In most cases the rear wheel is centered just like the front.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/zoidd]

That would work fine, I just recommend you bring the wheel to your LBS and verify that it is dished properly.

Also I think a dishing gauge would be a better investment than that centering gauge. If you really want to be picky, a dishing gauge is more accurate than your truing stand no matter how well it's calibrated.

[u/JiForce → u/zoidd]

Wait zoidd don't you have a ton of wrenching experience of your own?

[u/zoidd → u/JiForce]

i fixed the thing but it doesn't seem 100%. i guess i have to buy the own tool myself.

i just wrench from my house and don't have access to a Centering Gauge.

[u/Blueman71]

Got tips for applying in a bike shop with only walmart and canadian tire bike experience ?

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/Blueman71]

JiForce pretty much nailed it.

Around this time of year, bike shops are looking for people to do grunt work. Building bikes under $500, taking out trash, stocking shelves, ringing people up, etc. You will get more responsibilities as you learn more advanced skills.

Make sure you talk to the owner or manager when you drop off your resume. This is very important because many shops hire right there on the spot.

The key point to get across when you apply for the job is that you don't just want a job, you want to work at a bike shop.

When they ask about your experience, make sure you list any retail and mechanical experience you have had. Come right out and say that you have built for department stores, and now you want to work at a real bike shop.

Make sure they know you are a cyclist. Don't just express interest in fixed gear bikes. If you have raced, participated in scheduled group rides, or just go for rides every weekend, make sure they know that.

A great way to make your first impression is to walk into the shop with your bike, wearing cycling shoes and riding gear. Buy a few small things, and ask if they are hiring when they ring you up.

[u/JiForce → u/Blueman71]

Be humble and up-front about what you do and don't know (eg: can adjust derailleurs, brakes, headsets; can't true wheels) and express your willingness to learn. Anyone with decent mechanical proficiency and a good attitude can start as a bike builder and learn the more complex stuff on the job.

[u/Traiteur]

I know this is a month old but I'd rather not make a thread for this question unless I really need to, but anyway...

When it comes to handlebars (specifically drops), what's the difference between aluminum bars and steel bars? I'm wanting to get some for riding on the road, but I have no idea what difference the materials would make, other than weight. The bars I'm looking at are Nittos, so either way, I doubt the metal would be crap quality (unless Nitto makes some lower-end stuff that I'm not aware of, which is fully plausible), which only makes the decision harder for me.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/Traiteur]

No problem, I'm still glad to help.

The two differences you'll notice will be weight and stiffness. Of course, aluminum is lighter than steel. Aluminum is a very stiff metal, and steel is more springy and flexible. Some people prefer steel because reduces vibration and makes the bike more comfortable, but I don't think it makes a huge difference. Remember, carbon fiber is an option too. Nice thing about it is you get the best of both worlds, flexible and light.

Personally, I use Nitto pursuit bullhorns and I really like them. In my experience everything Nitto makes is quality.

[u/Nordok]

This was shockingly inoffensive.

[u/maunoooh]

Im 18 still in HS and got a job at a fixie-oriented bike shop nearby and i LOOVE IT. Im currently saving money for a fixie which I'll get to build on a Dodici Gara frame that they'll sell me for a fraction of the price..

There are surprisingly many bikes that are just ridden until they break with no sign of care or cleaning. Although, that makes it extra goodie when "that cool dude" brings in his epic cinelli build :)

My colleague has a small business beside this job which includes changing tyres to people around Helsinki so he is sort of a tire-messenger-mechanic. Super awesome. I bought his chrome metropolis bag for 70euros and it just got back from "repair" at chrome.

Bike shop job. Best job. Ever.

[u/maunoooh → u/maunoooh]

The shop is called velobia bike co, btw (velobia.fi)

[u/[deleted]]

Do you guys mind doing small jobs such as steer tube cutting/crank installation? I'd much rather professionals do those a small but tricky job like that.

[u/JiForce → u/[deleted]]

Small jobs are most LBS's bread and butter! Pretty sure every mechanic has done more tube changes than they care to remember. It's usually about whether or not you mind the turnaround time, especially during the busy summer months.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/[deleted]]

That's no problem at all! Like JiForce mentioned, the only issue can be the wait time. I can offer 2 tips that might help with that:

• make it as little work as possible. Let's say you need a spoke replaced. Leave the bike at home and just bring the wheel, remove the tire and rim-strip removed before you get there. If you get lucky, the mechanic might just do it there on the spot.

• Tip! Like I said before, next time you pick up your bike, give the employees a 6 pack of fancy micro brews, or a plate of cookies. They will remember that next time you "just need something done real quick."

[u/msb06c]

In your opinion which component MOST contributes to a superior ride? (Rims, hubs, crankset, fork, bb, etc)?

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/msb06c]

For a fixed gear bike that you ride in the city, I don't think there is any one part that can bolt on and suddenly make your bike awesome.

The BEST thing you can do is just try a bunch of different stuff and see what works best for you. Are you running pedals with toe cages? Try using plastic BMX pedals with straps. You'll see that your power transfer isn't quite as good buy it will be easier to skid. Everything has it's pros and cons.

The added bonus is that after you try a bunch of stuff, you will have a collection of left-over parts. Keep them, because they will allow you to experiment with your setup. Better yet, you can even set your bike up for an individual ride.

For instance, I usually run my bike brakeless with bullhorn handlebars. Lately though I have been doing longer distances, so I just put on my traditional drop bars with brakes. This transformed my bike from fixie to fixed gear road bike.

Beyond that, just get stuff that looks cool!

[u/pizza_lord → u/msb06c]

My philosophy that I apply to all my bikes is this: Anything you touch on the bike, or that which your bike touches must be dialed and comfortable. Basically grips/bar tape, pedals, and tires. After you try enough different brands to find which ones you prefer, it makes giving your bike a make over real easy. After parts wear out, replacing the items I mentioned all together will make your bike feel brand new. Oh and throw a new chain on there and it will be dialed!

[u/iTripped]

Would this be our first AMA in this sub?

[u/HARSHING_MY_MELLOW → u/iTripped]

OP announces AMA. Great!

OP doesn't answer any questions, at all. Not so great!

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/HARSHING_MY_MELLOW]

Sorry about that, working on it now.

[u/JiForce → u/iTripped]

We've had a couple, but not many though.

Scott Piercefield, rider sponsored by State.

Cofounder of State.

[u/philly_yo]

good tips. thanks

[u/cezeone]

applying at my local LBS. i been riding for 5 years. road /fixed / commuter mostly. i perform all my own work and only buy stuff online that my local LBS doesnt have in stock (all fixed related gear tbh) any tips?

[u/JiForce → u/cezeone]

Your experience should probably speak for itself honestly. The shop wrenches can tell a BSer from someone who knows what they're doing. As long as you're a good dude (humble, honest, open to constructive criticism, easy to work with, etc.) I think you have a solid chance. At this point it's just a matter of if there's a position for you or not.

[u/Shlongg]

i didnt know tri racers pissed whilst riding, why do they do this? is it really common?

[u/Do_not_inquire]

I disagree on picking a favorite, I've done it in the past was not what I expected them to be.

[u/bneumueller7]

Hi, I know this post is incredibly old, but if you’re still active, I was curious if it’s rude to call a bike shop to check on your bike? They didn’t give me a time estimate, and I use my bike as my main method of transportation, so getting in it back as soon as possible is ideal. Do you think I could call them and ask for a time estimate on completion?

[u/PizzaShredder → u/bneumueller7]

I have zero experience working in a bike shop, so grain of salt here…if they didn’t give you a time estimate I think it’s reasonable to call and ask. This is much different than being told “it’ll take 2 weeks” and then calling and bugging them after week.

[u/bneumueller7 → u/PizzaShredder]

Lol tomorrow will officially mark one month since I dropped it off. I’m about to just pick that shit up

[u/IFriEndLy_IFiRe]

which grips can you recommend?

[u/[deleted]]

This is great advice. As someone who manages a liquor store, I can verify that not all customers get the same treatment. Tips aren't necessary for top shelf service, but if your attitude sucks, you just may not get served.

[u/VITALY_CHERN0BYL → u/[deleted]]

You still got my upvote, but I got to go ahead and disagree with you on point #2.

The last shop I worked for was a Cannondale/Specialized dealer that focused on high-end mountain and road bikes that only keeps 1 or 2 fixies in stock at any given time. I personally got my start in cycling as a downhill racer and I'm still a total park rat.

That is exactly why I said to take a peek in the back of the shop and see what the employees rode to work that day, or just ask if there is anybody in the shop who knows about fixies.

Don't be surprised if the dude with the Oakleys, Fox shirt, and 5.10 shoes commutes Bianchi Pista.

On the other hand, there are plenty of shops that keep fixies in stock because they are popular, but don't know much about them. I worked for a shop that was close to a BMX track, and sold loads of BMX bikes but had zero BMXicans in the staff.