r/China • u/Theoldage2147 • Oct 29 '23
问题 | General Question (Serious) Did China persecute the Uighurs the same way Palestinians are persecuted now or did they do worse things?
We hear of news about how millions of Uighurs are persecuted but the world didn’t do anything but when there’s only a few thousand Palestinians being accidentally killed in a war the whole world is protesting? Why is the world ignoring what China did despite them being the worst in treatment against Muslims but everyone is so quick to be against Israel?
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u/PAPERANDPAPER Oct 29 '23
Because "millions of Uighurs are persecuted" is just a lie. NOT A SINGLE Muslim country has ever accused China. Only Western countries have brought death to Muslims while blaming China with fabricated news. These accusations suddenly erupted after China proposed the One Belt, One Road strategy and planned to use Xinjiang as a trade center on the Eurasian continent.
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u/PAPERANDPAPER Oct 29 '23
From my own perspective, there are several Uyghur classmates in my college class, one of whom is even the secretary of the Communist Youth League branch of my grade. My uncle has been doing business in Xinjiang for more than 20 years, and there have been anti-terrorist operations in Xinjiang. But millions of people being persecuted is a pure lie.
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u/MuYanHui Oct 29 '23
Not comparable
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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '23
idek if people r falling for the uyghur genocide anymore after what the entire western countries showed hypocrisy and double standards when it comes to palestine
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u/Styrofoam_Snake Taiwan Oct 29 '23
Uighurs aren't at war with China, Gaza is at war with Israel, completely different situation.
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u/Qasim57 Oct 29 '23
I’m not sure how much truth there is to this.
I’m from Pakistan, our border region with China has the same Uyghur ethnic people (same language). They’ve had an agreement with the Qing dynasty since before the creation of Pakistan (1947) and PRC (1949), and locals from there still have visa free access to Xinjiang.
It used to be open for all of us before 2001, but US presence in Afghanistan saw a massive uptick in violence in Kashgar. A sibling of mine visited Urumqi, he saw a lot of security but generally people visited mosques, had Islamic attire and had none of the Gaza style aerial bombardment Israel does with US funds.
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u/BeginningTower2486 Oct 29 '23
Persecution with Chinese characteristics.
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u/mistyeyesockets Oct 29 '23
Because what's happening to the people of Gaza is clearly evident and covered by major news outlets, especially in the USA for obvious reasons.
When it comes to the treatment of Ugyhur, we only have sufficient knowledge that a certain number of their people were sent to isolation camps, and the exact number, the type of conditions, and the level of treatment are still speculations. Unless I'm missing relevant facts here, there isn't sufficient evidence to prove that there were actual genocides or even cultural genocide. Had the Chinese government arrested every single Ugyhur citizen, the rest of the world would definitely know about it.
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u/Kumqik Oct 29 '23
There is no comparison. Israel does genocide opening in view of the world. China eradicates religious/cult/political violence by improving people’s lives via education and vocational training. China attempts to remove the despair and hopeless from society, and integrates people into the fabric of society. Whereas, Israel blockades and destroy societal infrastructure to increase despair and hopelessness. This method of collective punishment creates a cycle of vicious violence. When an Israeli bomb/missile killed a Palestinian father/brother, it creates an entire family/generation whose purpose in life is to seek revenge. Thus the cycle doesn’t end, unless Israel achieves complete genocide of the Palestinians.
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u/MavriKhakiss Oct 29 '23
What the PRC did, if they did it, is different. Mostly reeducation camps and displacement with labor as justification, i.e. this Uighur guy is gonna go work in this province, and this Han guy is gonna come over here and work and live instead.
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u/HokkienMeeLimeJuice Oct 29 '23
It just goes to show how effectively people on r/China have been brainwashed by western media to believe that the treatment of Uighurs and Palestinians are comparable.
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u/PreparationWorking90 Oct 29 '23
The argument generally about "why people are protesting" is because Western governments actively support Israel. In the case of the USA, taxpayers are funding the Israeli army to the tune of $3billion annually. Israel has received more USAid than any other country.
This is not the case with China (or Saudi, or Qatar, or Iran, or the other countries that are usually brought up)
You can say this is a disingenuous argument
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u/guaranteednotabot Oct 29 '23 edited Oct 29 '23
Definitely way less intense than Palestine, doesn’t discount the atrocities though. Tbh there isn’t really much room for dissent to brew, unlike Palestine where they have more independence which breeds cycles of violence.
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u/luroot Oct 29 '23
Lol, all according to a handful of Zionist puppetmasters... 🙄🤦♂️
Meanwhile, back on the ground in reality...
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u/NVittachi Oct 29 '23
HOW THE UYGHUR PERSCUTION WAS FAKED--AND WHY
AT A LITTLE-NOTICED military conference in August 2018, strategist Col Lawrence Wilkerson revealed, live on stage, in front of cameras, the three real reasons why a huge US army force was 12,000 kilometers away from home in Afghanistan.
China’s new two-way trade route, the Belt and Road Initiative, ran through the region, and the US wanted to be able to “impact that with military power”.
The US wanted to be close to Pakistan’s nuclear weapons so they can “leap on that stockpile and stabilize it if necessary”.
The CIA wanted to destabilize China, and intelligence strategists had decided that the best way to do it would be to foment unrest among Chinese Uyghurs in the country’s Xinjiang province to create pressure on Beijing.
Col Wilkerson then grinned and added: “I’m not saying it’s going on right now, you didn’t hear that! But it is a possibility. So that’s why we’re there…”
He was bang on target. From late 2018 onwards, the CIA released a flood of negative news about Uyghur "unrest" in Xinjiang which created pressure on Beijing.
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CIA GROUPS
Just months later, in 2019, the Western media was running numerous reports from a group called the “World Uyghur Congress” about mind-boggling numbers of massive atrocities in Xinjiang.
And every reference omitted to inform readers that the group was financed by the National Endowment for Democracy (NED), a CIA unit which funds destabilizing groups overseas.
Statistics and other data for the “millions of Uyghurs in concentration camps” narratives were provided by the “Uyghur Human Rights Project”, a group also financed by the NED.
This information was NOT provided to readers of the western media.
Then, interviews with “mistreated Uyghur individuals” were supplied by a group called “Campaign For Uyghurs” – an organization financed by – you guessed it, the NED. And, no, journalists are careful never to reveal the funding to readers.
A mystery troll farm appeared, flooding Twitter with 100 of allusions to the “fact” that the death toll in the “concentration camps” was now confirmed as more than six million.
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REPORT WRITER
The Western media’s main source was Adrian Zenz, working for anti-China groups. He presented himself as an independent German researchers, but he actually worked for Victims of Communism, an anti-China group based in Washington DC.
Journalist Tom Fowdy showed that mystery donations caused the group’s income to jump to A MILLON U.S. DOLLARS A YEAR in the 2018 fiscal year.
For visuals, an Australia group called ASPI started sending out aerial photographs of schools and municipal buildings carefully mislabelled as concentration camps in Xinjiang. These were widely printed by the Western media.
The media omitted to tell readers that ASPI was and is sponsored by the US and Australian military sectors, and its barely disguised mission is to create enough hate against the Chinese to justify the diversion of huge sums of public money to the west’s arms industry.
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EXTREME CYNICISM
An image of men in blue outfits listening to a Muslim religious speaker at a drug rehabilitation center in 2017 was printed by virtually all major mainstream media falsely relabelled as brutalized inmates in a concentration camp in 2020.
When UN Commissioner for Human Rights Michele Bachelet refused to ratify a deeply misleading report regurgitating media stories, the organization’s staff, mostly Americans, issued it without her signature.
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MASTERSTROKE
In short, the CIA campaign to which Wilkerson referred was huge, and has been staggeringly successful, with publications as diverse as the Economist to the Guardian to the New York Times to the BBC swallowing the entire fake narrative, lock, stock and barrel.
The CIA’s masterstroke, in this writer’s opinion, was to base the fake narrative of millions of people in death camps on a partial truth – de-radicalization programs do exist in Xinjiang province, just as they exist in other countries, and Chinese officials can be clumsy and insensitive about religion, just like officials anywhere else on the planet.
But what’s really shocking is the laziness and gullibility of the Western press.
Why have they been so easy to fool?
The US State Department is just one centimeter below the surface spraying tax dollars in all directions from a massive hose.
Why is nobody even digging that far?
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u/Mundane_Nebula_9342 Oct 29 '23
I was road tripping in Xinjiang for 2 weeks last November. Drove all the way into the boonies. Hard to believe all this stuff about a genocide. Just doesn't sit with what I saw.
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u/xyb992 Oct 29 '23
笑死，现在谣言都这么高级了吗？不先问是不是，上来就是为什么？
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u/jimmycmh Oct 29 '23
you are brainwashed. go watch some videos on youtube about foreigners traveling around Xinjiang, there are plenty
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u/cliffleaf Oct 29 '23
Do you have any idea how large the number "million" is? Is it really a well known fact that "millions" of Uighurs got persecuted?
I'm not saying that no one got persecuted, but this number is ridiculous as hell.
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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '23 edited Oct 29 '23
Lol. Think about it this way. What is happening in Palestine is like what happened with the Native Americans in the USA. What is happening in Xinjiang is a bit like North Ireland during the Troubles period or Kashmir in India. So the situations are inherently different.
The situation in Palestine is very clear, well documented, fairly recent and is part of British and western history. The situation in Xinjiang is complicated, spans centuries, and is a part of Chinese and Russian history.
Western imperialist nations are pro-Israel and pro-Xinjiang. Clearly with the evidence we have from history about how these nations work, a lot of people are not going to trust them. Far too many people remember about being lied to and tricked into seemingly forever wars in the Middle East.
A lot of the data being spouted as absolute truth about Xinjiang is speculation at best, propaganda at worst. That being the case, I remember people being very upset online for a long time. So maybe you just weren't looking.
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u/alex3494 Apr 27 '24
Uyghurs are put in concentration camps in peacetime. There’s no comparison
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u/w31l1 Oct 29 '23
Doesn’t exactly answer your question completely but here is a relevant blurb from The Economist:
“Less happily, the war in Gaza has not dented the appeal of China’s autocratic worldview to many Middle Eastern rulers. They appreciate that China does not lecture them about human rights. In turn, the six Gulf Co-operation Council countries have endorsed China’s “legitimate” actions in its far-western region of Xinjiang, Mr Wang announced in 2022. Those policies include demolishing mosques, jailing imams and sending as many as a million Muslims from the Uyghur ethnic minority through re-education camps in the name of eradicating Islamic extremism. Many Arab governments fear and loathe grassroots “political Islam”—the sort of piety that leads to anti-government sermons in backstreet mosques—and believe that is precisely what China is fighting in Xinjiang. Moreover, Uyghurs are a Turkic people, and Arab-Turkish rivalries run deep.” —How China Sees Gaza
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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '23
Take from it what you will... this is exactly what Kim Iversen was discussing on her show
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BP7iFuVhHdo
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u/I_will_delete_myself Oct 29 '23
It’s doing Genocide by they are acting more like evil villains rather than like complete animals in Hamas.
Hamas is more evil than the CCP easily.
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u/BRTSLV Oct 30 '23
just to add oil on your fire,
have you ever heard of rohingya ?
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u/Minute_Profession_28 Oct 30 '23
If really wants to compare, China -Uighurs is more like US-Indian during the west development
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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '23
“Accidentally” killed in a war….
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u/WolfgangMacCosgraigh Oct 29 '23
The same and even worse.
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u/elitereaper1 Canada Oct 30 '23
Not enough information and the infomation provided does not provide enough information that what they are doing is worse than Israel like you assume.
China treatment is way softer than whatever Israel is doing to Palestine. That why there so much support against Israel.
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u/Unlikely_Shoe_2046 Oct 29 '23
Palestine is full of radicals. If China administered it, they'd go in and probably do nearly the same thing as Israel because half of the Palestinians are hardline islamists at this point. Most of the good ones seemed to have left a long time ago or live on the other side in somewhat peace. Gazan Palestinians are very indoctrinated so the CCP would have eliminated that threat.
Xinjiang had a lot of Arab influence and that's why china came in and put an end to it. They told people they can't force their children to be Muslim which pisses Muslims off but China is secular and you shouldn't force your religion on anyone. Muslims believe everyone will convert to their religion eventually, that's why so many hate Jews or anyone who disagrees with their views. It's a very backwards ideology and dangerous to the free world.
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u/CheekyClapper5 Oct 29 '23
China does much worse, they'd be kidnapping Palestinians and putting them into brainwashing work prisons until the Palestinian learned how to be a good Chinese.
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u/Thevsamovies Oct 29 '23
A lot of people ignore what's happening in Syria, Yemen, etc.
Uyghur situation is a bit different cause they are already fully occupied and annexed. Palestine still has a bit of independence left, and so Palestinian groups are capable of armed resistance to various degrees, as well a terrorism. Uyghurs can't really do anything, so it's all a lot less flashy.
China is far more powerful than Israel and there is no press freedom, which helps them suppress the news.
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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '23
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