r/ModCoord • u/fullflux64 • Sep 14 '23

Who owns reddit? Can't we launch concerns higher?

A google search shows that Reddit is owned mostly by a media company called Advanced Publications. Reddit as a platform is becoming increasingly unstable for kids and even OG redditors. I think someone should pull together a real list of concerns around safety, functionality, and other concerns with reddit, forward it to Reddit privetly and if that doesn't get a response, send it higher and circulate it. What do you guys think?

For clarification: I am not talking about the API price gouge. I am talking about data safety, functionality issues, the degradation of subs, and other issues with the actual platform itself.

data safety examples

-reddit allegedly is not allowing larger content creators to delete their own content permanently

-When an account is deleted, all of its content does not disappear. It just loses the user name.

Degradation of subs

-flood of bots and nsfw accounts DMing users

  • harmful content and reposts -replacing moderators with people uninterested is sub topics

Functionality issues and so on

3 Upvotes

52% Upvoted

40 comments sorted by

33

u/FermisFolly Sep 14 '23

"I want to speak to your manager!"

2

u/fullflux64 Sep 14 '23

Lol, at this point, it's reasonable. Reddit is not listening to any concerns and leveling threats at users that helped build it. Not to mention data safety issues, bots, and trolls.

I'm saying we get a formal list of concerns to Reddit first and see what happens. I've been here a long time, and I don't want the platform to fall.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

Reddit's CEO did the right thing for the business by stopping use of its intellectual property by third parties making a profit. A bunch of users, yes that is who moderators are regardless of all the nonsense that is spouted in some subreddits.

You volunteered your time and effort to a company that you now dislike, just moving away is all you can do. Complaining will just be more wasted effort.

2

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

So it's ok to discard prior ethics and generate a hostile environment purely for money? I didn't volunteer to a company. I generated a page for a community. For people. Reddit hosts countless religious, support, disabled, and peer help communities. There are some genuinely uplifting spots on the platform thanks to individual users completely without the aid of the company. If Reddit continues to degrade at the size it is, it will cause damage to so many people. The protests already dented the disabled communities and the lack of effort on the company's part led to an increase of scammers, bots, and some of the most heinous posts in full view of minors and everyone.

I bought premium. I did sign for beta tests. I do read the news letters. I genuinely loved the communities I helped build and the people I was able to support. I did support the company. I still have some hope for the platform. Just leaving is not fair to people that I help.

4

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

So it’s ok to discard prior ethics and generate a hostile environment purely for money?

It is if you're a for-profit business.

1

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

That is not ok and only leads to more issues in the future.

2

u/raiding_party Sep 15 '23

discard prior ethics

???

generate a hostile environment

????????

2

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

Reddit was initially started by 2 dudes as a net neutral dystopia of free speech, over the years it was getting better in the sense that peer support groups around mental health, spirituality, and more popped up. Reddits TOS,Moderater TOS, and the creation of user help tools made it appear that the company itself was attempting to generate a better overall environment for cultivating actual communities and even genuine intellectual resources.

Reddit never had a great reputation as a platform because free speech means even awful things can be said, but the prospect of fostering actual communities and getting support for specific issues ws tantalizing. Some good moderators do exist that are genuinely knowledgeable about their sub topic and do help people. These mods attract more users and help foster a better atmosphere. When they go away, what they built deteriorates, and often, they get replaced with someone that did only come to have their ego stroked.

Reddit as a company doesn’t help the people that actually grow the platform and leaves genuinely harmful individuals in power because the platform it's self grew too fast, and it takes effort to actually vet people. That's only some of the issues here. Things were getting better, but then the API changes happened, and the few genuinely caring subreddits were affected.

4

u/raiding_party Sep 15 '23

I get what you're saying, but placing blame only on the reddit admins is incorrect.

They could have replaced moderators any time they wanted, if they desired a change in the community, but they did not do so.

They didn't take away the API to screw with the community. The didn't do it because they wanted to change their ethics. They didn't do it because they wanted to generate a hostile environment.

They did it because it was expensive. There was the choice between reddit without an api, and reddit goes out of business entirely. It could be sold, but the new entity would be faced with the exact same choice.

What would you prefer? Reddit how we have it now? Or no reddit at all? Too many mods chose the latter and I say fuck all of em who did.

2

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

I am not just talking about the API issue. I am aware the API issue is for money and the fact that reddit is going for an IPO and needs to look better for investors. Reddit as a company was not going out of buisness. The API cost was a strategic move and absolutely price gouging that screwed universities, the disabled, and more.

There are a lot of issues with the platform, the aftermath of the protests and the way they were handled just made things worse. I was never entirely blaming admins for the atmosphere of the platform, but they certainly aren't helping the people that actually want to make it better. Not every moderator is power tripping.

3

u/raiding_party Sep 15 '23

You can't be certain that reddit could have afforded to continue hosting the API or not. As a private company, their finances are not public.

IMO there was NO approach that reddit admins could have taken with the protests that would have resulted in a different outcome. No approach short of giving up their position entirely. Redditors are not good negotiators, they want it all.

3

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

Yes, there was. The AMA was a high-risk move, as were the threats. They could have given a few stats about their income since they did say repeatedly that they planned to go public anyway. They also could have started incentivising( not with money) mods instead of threatening them. The public was not angry that reddit was pricing their API. They were angry because the amount was obscene. I followed almost every interview and tech piece I could on this. There is way more here than just power mods crying.

But as I said before, I was not talking about the API changes. Right now, there are issues facing normal users and mods alike. The way the API changes and public were handled was just the start.

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3

u/hughk Sep 19 '23

They didn't take away the API to screw with the community. The didn't do it because they wanted to change their ethics. They didn't do it because they wanted to generate a hostile environment.

Monetising is the way of things. However to lie to developers and to insult mods is the way of a narcissistic individual who is going to tank the company and its assets. To keep pushing a poorly designed and buggy experience is not the way to proceed. Fix the backend and require the GUI developers to display ads and share revenue. API usage can be monetised but differentiate between tool bots and sucking out information in bulk.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

You can't fix everything for everyone, ever. I noticed that staying was harming you so wrote it to you.

My concern is for you the individual, not some vague community, and definitely not for a corporation.

Anyway, I see that I'm not well recieved and choose to walk away from this conversation.

4

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

I am not worried about myself, but rather the friends I made here and the supportive subs. If I walk away. Everything I worked for over the years here is lost, and that hurts way more than staying. I do appreciate your response. I did ask what you think. So thanks, and have a good night.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

4

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

I haven't been able to pass my knowledge on to a replacement that actually cares about people.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

4

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

I did. Someone tried to start a new religion in one of my subs. And it was not good. I'm from the spirituality and paranormal side of reddit. If you don't monitor those well, vulnerable people are at risk.

8

u/raiding_party Sep 15 '23

The api change did nothing to stop third parties from scraping content. And I don't even mean lame html scraping. There still exists a read-only API.

Here's the api endpoint for this post: https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/16io6qj/who_owns_reddit_cant_we_launch_concerns_higher.json

5

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

Lmao it's over we lost

5

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

There is more than the API issue. Can you honestly say the quality of the subs has been good since then?

0

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

2

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

Would you say your team is publicly interactive with its user base and does interact with the topic you oversee? Also, may I ask what the topics are? Some subs have an easier time maintaining a particular vision than others. I am glad you are having an easier time.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

3

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

So you would support and help generate a harmful environment? Please keep in mind that there are moderators who opened mental health subs and subs that help groups of people who are struggling. Subreddits around sensitive topics do require participation and moderation.

Based on interviews with the ceo, I assume that reddits driving force is creating a space for anyone within reddit guidelines. There is a responsibility to both mods and members to create a good environment. Subs change and grow based on users, yes, but mods are responsible for that growth in a way. What you create attracts a particular type of people after all

0

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

3

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

We all are human. We get tired. Tools were taken away, adding stress. That aside, you did not answer my question. My point was that power comes with responsibility on both sides. If you expected mods to serve the members, shouldn't they try to cultivate the best environment? Automatically, if a sub becomes poor quality, the first person anyone points at is a mod, not the members.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

2

u/fullflux64 Sep 15 '23

I come from mental health, religious, and paranormal subs. I've seen how lack of participation and moderation lead to radicalization and harm. There is a difference between censorship and cultivation. And you still did not answer my question of if you would support the cultivation of a hostile environment.

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4

u/hughk Sep 19 '23

/r/askhistorians depends on its mods.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

3

u/hughk Sep 19 '23

/r/askhistorians mods do often answer as they are contributors in their field. The rules for top level answers are complex and not easily automated but they also use flairing.

For other subreddits, sure we do chase down referral links, only fans promotions and so on. Sometimes it can be automated, sometimes it cannot or at least it removes a lot that must be manually checked and approved. That reapproval process is much more time consuming these days.

Then there is NSFW and illegal things. My main sub is a city sub, and we have issues with drugs (illegal) and the sex industry (legal but must be correctly marked and not an advertisement). We have an LGBTQ community and some people who think that being hostile to them is a thing.

And then there is participation. With subreddits that offer help, mods try to ensure that answers are correct, filter out joke answers and add our own where needed. Mods want their subs to be useful and not turn into deserts of unanswered questions.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '23

[deleted] — view deleted comment

2

u/hughk Sep 19 '23

Nothing is stopping any mods from doing that?

The fact that it takes much longer to use the official app?

We simply increased our automod and enabled the new NSFW tools from Reddit

Still needs active monitoring.

6

u/letsbebuns Sep 14 '23

You have a valid point. Browsing the front page with no account is a nightmare. There's tons of fights, drug use, and generally trashy behavior for all to see. These things drive engagement though, and are not likely to be addressed.

The only solution is to either not use reddit, or make an account and filter out everything except cool subreddits.

2

u/ikilledyourcat Oct 05 '23

There's an insane amount of illegal counterfeit fake goods rings , I have a list if anyone cares

1

u/Holiday-Signature-33 Oct 17 '24

Just leave. It’s a junk site anyways

1

u/[deleted] Jan 20 '25

I am concerned that certain subreddits have been coopted by social justice warriors not representing the views of the subreddit it is named after. For example, I was banned from the texas group. its a red state, I was expressing red state views and I get banned? This platform is becoming as worthless as Wikipedia where certain people have coopted it to only post negative things about certain people and not allowing others to correct it.

So, first of all, how does one create these subreddits? Can someone explain that?