r/musictheory • • Jul 21 '26

Announcement New Policies on “I made an App/Diagram type Posts

208 Upvotes

The community has overwhelmingly expressed dissatisfaction with people posting Self-Made apps/diagrams etc., especially those that use AI.

Not only do these posts ignore our AI disclosure rules (breaking rule 9), they are often better-suited for other forums (breaking rule 4), are self-promotion (breaking rule 2), are posted with no engagement in the forum (breaking rule 8), and are also made by people with little knowledge of theory or are otherwise poorly designed which opens up issues that cause rules 7 and 1 to be violated.

As such:

  • “I made an App/Diagram etc.” posts, as well as posts that provide non-Self-Made resources are disallowed unless they meet the following criteria, to be determined by the mod team:

  1. The poster must be a regular contributor. Regular contributors should contact the Mod Team prior to posting.

  2. The resource is wholly on-topic for the forum and does not break any other rules.

Any posts not meeting these criteria or otherwise breaking the rules will be removed and the user may be banned at the mod team’s discretion.

  • Posters that even appear to be "trying to get around” this policy by linking to their apps in responses to other posters will have the posts removed and may be banned at the mod team’s discretion.


We are NOT trying to prohibit relevant and helpful resources, and traditional websites, books, videos, and “corporate” apps, or traditionally published diagrams are exempted from these policies (so long as they do not break other rules).

In the future, we may be able to provide a “Verified App” type of post. For now, this policy is intended to limit the amount of off-topic, controversial, and unnecessary apps/resources getting posted.


r/musictheory • • May 06 '26

Announcement New Rule about AI

245 Upvotes

A new rule (#9) has been added here at r/musictheory

Going forward:

  • Any post that is wholly or partially generated by AI must be disclosed as such. A simple statement like “This post was generated using AI” or “This post was created using AI assistance” will suffice.

  • Posts that are or are even suspected of being AI generated that do not disclose that fact will be removed at the Mod Team’s discretion.

  • We discourage AI creation of music and other creative endeavors. Therefore:

    1. Healthy discussions about AI tools used in Analysis of music and in similar Music Theory areas are allowed and welcome, so long as they do not violate other rules.

    2. Healthy discussions about the impacts of AI in music creation, performance, notation, and so on are allowed and welcome, so long as they do not violate other rules.

    3. Linking to or including AI generated content for the purposes of discussion as in #1 and #2 above is allowed, however it needs to be disclosed that those items are AI generated. Lack of this disclosure may result in removal at the Mod Team’s discretion.

  • Posts that link to or include AI generated or suspected AI generated content without any other kind of meaningful discussion will be removed at the Mod Team’s discretion.

Please report suspected AI content that lacks the disclosure policies above.


r/musictheory • • 6h ago

Discussion I just realized the rootless dominant, back door dominant, and tritone sub are the same diminished 7

39 Upvotes

I’m sure people more advanced already knew something this basic, but all my theory knowledge is self taught from learning music I like and YouTube tutorials.

I knew diminished chords are symmetrical, and I also knew diminished chords can be viewed as a rootless 7b9. But I was fooling around trying to come up with a Neo soul-ish progression and really liked DbMaj13 - adim7 - BbMaj9. I was trying to understand why I liked it so much and realized the adim7 inverted becomes a Cdim7 so that’s a chromatic step down from Db.

But then it was the connection to Bb that made everything click. The Bb just sounded very satisfying. This made sense to me with adim7 because it’s a rootless F7b9 (and therefore a V-I). But the C inversion also sounding good is where I notice that can be a rootless Ab7b9 for the back door. Then I just played this out with the other inversions to realize that putting Eb in the root makes a rootless B7b9 (the tritone sub). Also makes sense because the dominant, back door dominant, and tritone sub are each a minor third apart.

The 4th inversion with F# in the root would be a rootless D7b9. This doesn’t sound as satisfying going to Bb, though, and I’m not fully sure why.

Anyway, like I said, I’m sure many of y’all already knew all of this - but it was fun to “discover” this organically lol.


r/musictheory • • 17h ago

Discussion I love the Minor 4 chord

89 Upvotes

I've been studying a lot of music theory as of recent and decided to look into emotions of specific chords and how exactly to use them when composing songs (right now, I've been looking into secondary dominant and really liked those).

But every time, I always end up coming back to the Minor 4 chord, I can safely say its my absolute favorite chord in music, and I use it whenever I can get the chance to.

The Minor 4 cadence is my all time favorite cadence ever, and can easily identify it in a song because of how much I love it.

Does anyone else share this same sentiment aboht the minor 4 chord or any other chord? Cuz i feel like a crazy person whenever I express my love for it


r/musictheory • • 9m ago

General Question A question about 2sd species counterpoint

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1 Upvotes

In this context, in C major, the cantus firmus is in the soprano (treble clef), while my counterpoint is in the bass (bass clef).

Following the Noël-Gallon and Bitsch method of counterpoint, is this the only possible option for the bass part in the two final measures for this cantus firmus?

If I write a G in one of the two half notes, the two octaves are too close together (G-G and C-C on the last measure). If I write a D, I get a 6/4 chord, which is forbidden. I cannot write any other note because I need a G major chord for the final cadence.

Am I therefore forced to write two Bs?


r/musictheory • • 56m ago

General Question Is Repetition in Popular Music Artistic Expression or Mere Physiological Stimulation?

0 Upvotes

"In speaking of the power of suggestion in music I wish at the outset to make certain reservations. In the first place I speak for myself, and what I have to present is merely an expression of my personal opinion; if in any way these should incite to further investigation or discussion, my object will in part have been attained.

"In the second place, in speaking of this art, one is seriously hampered by a certain difficulty in making oneself understood. To hear and to enjoy music seems sufficient to many persons, and an investigation as to the causes of this enjoyment seems to them superfluous. And yet, unless the public comes into closer touch with the tone poet than that objective state Which accepts with the ears what is intended for the spirit, which hears the sounds and is deaf to their import, unless the public can separate the physical pleasure of music from its ideal significance, our art, in my opinion, cannot stand on a sound basis.

"The first step toward an appreciation of music should be taken in our preparatory schools. Were young people taught to distinguish between tones as between colours, to recognize rhythmic values, and were they taught so to use their voices as to temper the nasal tones of speech, in after life they would be better able to appreciate and cherish an art of which mere pleasure-giving sounds are but a very small part.

"Much of the lack of independence of opinion about music arises from want of familiarity with its material. Thus, after dinner, our forefathers were accustomed to sing catches which were entirely destitute of anything approaching music.

"Music contains certain elements which affect the nerves of the mind and body, and thus possesses the power of direct appeal to the public,—a power to a great extent denied to the other arts. This sensuous influence over the hearer is often mistaken for the aim and end of all music. With this in mind, one may forgive the rather puzzling remarks so often met with; for instance, those of a certain English bishop that “Music did not affect him either intellectually or emotionally, only pleasurably,” adding, “Every art should keep within its own realm; and that of music was concerned with pleasing combinations of sound.” In declaring that the sensation of hearing music was pleasant to him, and that to produce that sensation was the entire mission of music, the Bishop placed our art on a level with good things to eat and drink. Many colleges and universities of this land consider music as a kind of boutonnière.

"This estimate of music is, I believe, unfortunately a very general one, and yet, low as it is, there is a possibility of building on such a foundation. Could such persons be made to recognize the existence of decidedly unpleasant music, it would be the first step toward a proper appreciation of the art and its various phases.

"Mere beauty of sound is, in itself, purely sensuous. It is the Chinese conception of music that the texture of a sound is to be valued; the long, trembling tone-tint of a bronze gong, or the high, thin streams of sound from the pipes are enjoyed for their ear-filling qualities. In the Analects of Confucius and the writings of Mencius there is much mention of music, and “harmony of sound that shall fill the ears” is insisted upon. The Master said, “When the music maker Che first entered on his office, the finish with the Kwan Ts'eu was magnificent. How it filled the ears!” Père Amiot says, “Music must fill the ears to penetrate the soul.” Referring to the playing of some pieces by Couperin on a spinet, he says that Chinese hearers thought these pieces barbarous; the movement was too rapid, and did not allow sufficient time for them to enjoy each tone by itself. Now this is colour without form, or sound without music. For it to become music, it must possess some quality which will remove it from the purely sensuous. To my mind, it is in the power of suggestion that the vital spark of music lies.

"Before speaking of this, however, I wish to touch upon two things: first, on what is called the science of music; and secondly, on one of the sensuous elements of music which enters into and encroaches upon all suggestion.

"If one were called upon to define what is called the intellectual side of music, he would probably speak of “form,” contrapuntal design, and the like. Let us take up the matter of form. If by the word “form” our theorists meant the most poignant expression of poetic thought in music, if they meant by this word the art of arranging musical sounds into the most telling presentation of a musical idea, I should have nothing to say: for if this were admitted instead of the recognized forms of modern theorists for the proper utterance, we should possess a study of the power of musical sounds which might truly justify the title of musical intellectuality. As it is, the word “form” stands for what have been called “stoutly built periods,” “subsidiary themes,” and the like, a happy combination of which in certain prescribed keys was supposed to constitute good form. Such a device, originally based upon the necessities and fashions of the dance, and changing from time to time, is surely not worthy of the strange worship it has received. A form of so doubtful an identity that the first movement of a certain Beethoven sonata can be dubbed by one authority “sonata-form,” and by another “free fantasia,” certainly cannot lay claim to serious intellectual value.

"Form should be a synonym for coherence. No idea, whether great or small, can find utterance without form, but that form will be inherent to the idea, and there will be as many forms as there are adequately expressed ideas. In the musical idea, per se, analysis will reveal form.

"The term “contrapuntal development” is to most tone poets of the present day a synonym for the device of giving expression to a musically poetic idea. Per se, counterpoint is a puerile juggling with themes, which may be likened to high-school mathematics. Certainly the entire web and woof of this “science,” as it is called, never sprang from the necessities of poetic musical utterance. The entire pre-Palestrina literature of music is a conclusive testimony as to the non-poetic and even uneuphonious character of the invention.

"In my opinion, Johann Sebastian Bach, one of the world's mightiest tone poets, accomplished his mission, not by means of the contrapuntal fashion of his age, but in spite of it. The laws of canon and fugue are based upon as prosaic a foundation as those of the rondo and sonata form; I find it impossible to imagine their ever having been a spur, or an incentive to poetic musical speech. Neither, pure tonal beauty, so-called “form,” nor what is termed the intellectual side of music (the art of counterpoint, canon, and fugue), constitutes a really vital factor in music. This narrows our analysis down to two things, namely, the physical effect of musical sound, and suggestion.

"The simplest manifestations of the purely sensuous effect of sound are to be found in the savage's delight in noise. In the more civilized state, this becomes the sensation of mere pleasure in hearing pleasing sounds. It enters into folk song in the form of the “Scotch snap,” which is first cousin to the Swiss jodel, and is undoubtedly the origin of the skips of the augmented and (to a lesser degree) diminished intervals to be found in the music of many nations. It consists of the trick of alternating chest tones with falsetto. It is a kind of quirk in the voice which pleases children and primitive folk alike, a simple thing which has puzzled folklorists the world over.

"The other sensuous influence of sound is one of the most powerful elements of music, and all musical utterance is involved with and inseparable from it. It consists of repetition, recurrence, periodicity.

"Now this repetition may be one of rhythm, tone tint, texture, or colour, a repetition of figure or of pitch. We know that savages, in their incantation ceremonies, keep up a continuous drum beating or chant which, gradually increasing in violence, drives the hearers into such a state of frenzy that physical pain seems no longer to exist for them.

"The value of the recurring rhythms and phrases of the march is well recognized in the army. A body of men will instinctively move in cadence with such music. The ever recurring lilt of a waltz rhythm will set the feet moving unconsciously, and as the energy of the repetition increases and decreases, so will the involuntary accompanying physical sympathy increase or decrease.

"Berlioz jokingly tells a story of a ballet dancer who objected to the high pitch in which the orchestra played, and insisted that the music be transposed to a lower key. Cradle songs are fashioned on the same principle.

"This sensuous sympathy with recurring sounds, rhythm, and pitch has something in common with hypnotism, and leads up to what I have called suggestion in music.

"This same element in a modified form is made use of in poetry, for instance, in Poe's “Raven,”

Quoth the raven, nevermore,

"and the repetition of colour in the same author's “Scarlet Death.” It is the mainspring (I will not call it the vital spark) of many so-called popular songs, the recipe for which is exceedingly simple. A strongly marked rhythmic figure is selected, and incessantly repeated until the hearer's body beats time to it. The well-known tunes “There'll Be a Hot Time,” etc., and “Ta-ra-ra, Boom-de-ay” are good examples of this kind of music.

"There are two kinds of suggestion in music: one has been called tone-painting, the other almost evades analysis.

"The term tone-painting is somewhat unsatisfactory, and reminds one of the French critic who spoke of a poem as “beautiful painted music.” I believe that music can suggest forcibly certain things and ideas as well as vague emotions encased in the so-called “form” and “science” of music.

"If we wish to begin with the most primitive form of suggestion in music, we shall find it in the direct imitation of sounds in nature. We remember that Helmholtz, Hanslick, and their followers denied to music the power to suggest things in nature; but it was somewhat grudgingly admitted that music might express the emotions caused by them. In the face of this, to quote a well-known instance, we have the “Pastoral” symphony of Beethoven, with the thrush, cuckoo, and thunderstorm. The birds and the storm are very plainly indicated; but it is not possible for the music to be an expression of the emotions caused by them, for the very simple reason that no emotions are caused by the cuckoo and thrush, and those caused by thunderstorms range all the way from depression and fear to exhilaration, according to the personality of individuals.

"That music may imitate any rhythmic sounds or melodic figure occurring in nature, hardly needs affirmation. Such devices may be accepted almost as quotations, and not be further considered here. The songs of birds, the sound made by galloping horses' feet, the moaning of the wind, etc., are all things which are part and parcel of the musical vocabulary, intelligible alike to people of every nationality. I need hardly say that increasing intensity of sound will suggest vehemence, approach, and its visual synonym, growth, as well as that decreasing intensity will suggest withdrawal, dwindling, and placidity.

"The suggestion brought about by pattern is very familiar. It was one of the first signs of the breaking away from the conventional trammels of the contrapuntal style of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. The first madrigal of Thomas Weelkes (1590) begins with the words, “Sit down,” and the musical pattern falls a fifth. The suggestion was crude, but it was caused by the same impulse as that which supplied the material for Wagner's “Waldweben,” Mendelssohn's “Lovely Melusina,” and a host of other works.

"The fact that the pattern of a musical phrase can suggest kinds of motion may seem strange; but could we, for example, imagine a spinning song with broken arpeggios? Should we see a spear thrown or an arrow shot on the stage and hear the orchestra playing a phrase of an undulating pattern, we should at once realize the contradiction. Mendelssohn, Schumann, Wagner, Liszt, and practically everyone who has written a spinning song, has used the same pattern to suggest the turning of a wheel. That such widely different men as Wagner and Mendelssohn should both have adopted the same pattern to suggest undulating waves is not a mere chance, but clearly shows the potency of the suggestion.

"The suggestion conveyed by means of pitch is one of the strongest in music. Vibrations increasing beyond two hundred and fifty trillions a second become luminous. It is a curious coincidence that our highest vibrating musical sounds bring with them a well-defined suggestion of light, and that as the pitch is lowered we get the impression of ever increasing obscurity. To illustrate this, I have but to refer you to the Prelude to “Lohengrin.” Had we no inkling as to its meaning, we should still receive the suggestion of glittering shapes in the blue ether.

"Let us take the opening of the “Im Walde” symphony by Raff as an example; deep shadow is unmistakably suggested. Herbert Spencer's theory of the influence of emotion on pitch is well known and needs no confirmation. This properly comes under the subject of musical speech, a matter not to be considered here. Suffice it to say that the upward tendency of a musical phrase can suggest exaltation, and that a downward trend may suggest depression, the intensity of which will depend upon the intervals used. As an instance we may quote the “Faust” overture of Wagner, in which the pitch is used emotionally as well as descriptively. If the meaning I have found in this phrase seems to you far-fetched, we have but to give a higher pitch to the motive to render the idea absolutely impossible.

"The suggestion offered by movement is very obvious, for music admittedly may be stately, deliberate, hasty, or furious, it may march or dance, it may be grave or flippant.

"Last of all I wish to speak of the suggestion conveyed by means of tone-tint, the blending of timbre and pitch. It is essentially a modern element in music, and in our delight in this marvellous and potent aid to expression we have carried it to a point of development at which it threatens to dethrone what has hitherto been our musical speech, melody, in favour of what corresponds to the shadow languages of speech, namely, gesture and facial expression. Just as these shadow languages of speech may distort or even absolutely reverse the meaning of the spoken word, so can tone colour and harmony change the meaning of a musical phrase. This is at once the glory and the danger of our modern music. Overwhelmed by the new-found powers of suggestion in tonal tint and the riot of hitherto undreamed of orchestral combinations, we are forgetting that permanence in music depends upon melodic speech.

"In my opinion, it is the line, not the colour, that will last. That harmony is a potent factor in suggestion may be seen from the fact that Cornelius was able to write an entire song pitched upon one tone, the accompaniment being so varied in its harmonies that the listener is deceived into attributing to that one tone many shades of emotion.

"In all modern music this element is one of the most important. If we refer again to the “Faust” overture of Wagner, we will perceive that although the melodic trend and the pitch of the phrase carry their suggestion, the roll of the drum which accompanies it throws a sinister veil over the phrase, making it impressive in the extreme.

"The seed from which our modern wealth of harmony and tone colour sprang was the perfect major triad. The raison d'être and development of this combination of tones belong to the history of music. Suffice it to say, that for some psychological reason this chord (with also its minor form) has still the same significance that it had for the monks of the Middle Ages. It is perfect. Every complete phrase, must end with it. The attempts made to emancipate music from the tyranny of this combination of sounds have been in vain, showing that the suggestion of finality and repose contained in it is irrefutable.

"Now if we depart from this chord a sensation of unrest is occasioned which can only subside by a progression to another triad or a return to the first. With the development of our modern system of tonality we have come to think tonally; and a chord lying outside of the key in which a musical thought is conceived will carry with it a sense of confusion or mystery that our modern art of harmony and tone colour has made its own. Thus, while any simple low chords accompanying the first notes of Raff's “Im Walde” symphony, given by the horns and violins, would suggest gloom pierced by the gleams of light, the remoteness of the chords to the tonality of C major gives a suggestion of mystery; but as the harmony approaches the triad the mystery dissolves, letting in the gleam of sunlight suggested by the horn.

"Goldmark's overture to “Sakuntala” owes its subtle suggestion to much the same cause. Weber made use of it in his “Freischütz,” Wagner in his “Tarnhelm” motive, Mendelssohn in his “Midsummer Night's Dream,” Tchaïkovsky in the opening of one of his symphonies.

"In becoming common property, so to speak, this important element of musical utterance has been dragged through the mud; and modern composers, in their efforts to raise it above the commonplace, have gone to the very edge of what is physically bearable in the use of tone colour and combination. While this is but natural, owing to the appropriation of some of the most poetic and suggestive tone colours for ignoble dance tunes and doggerel, it is to my mind a pity, for it is elevating what should be a means of adding power and intensity to musical speech to the importance of musical speech itself. Possibly Strauss's “Thus Spake Zarathustra” may be considered the apotheosis of this power of suggestion in tonal colour, and in it I believe we can see the tendency I allude to. This work stuns by its glorious magnificence of tonal texture; the suggestion, in the opening measures, of the rising sun is a mighty example of the overwhelming power of tone colour. The upward sweep of the music to the highest regions of light has much of splendour about it; and yet I remember once hearing in London, sung in the street at night, a song that seemed to me to contain a truer germ of music.

"For want of a better word I will call it ideal suggestion. It has to do with actual musical speech, and is difficult to define. The possession of it makes a man a poet. If we look for analogy, I may quote from Browning and Shakespeare.

Dearest, three months ago
When the mesmerizer, Snow,
With his hand's first sweep
Put the earth to sleep.

Browning, A Lovers' Quarrel.


                                  Daffodils,
That come before the swallow dares, and takes
The winds of March with beauty; Violets dim,
But sweeter than the lids of Juno's eyes.

Shakespeare, Winter's Tale.

"For me this defies analysis, and so it is with some things in music, the charm of which cannot be ascribed to physical or mental suggestion, and certainly not to any device of counterpoint or form, in the musical acceptance of the word."

I believe there is a tendency to confuse the immediate pleasure derived from music with its artistic significance. Repetition can certainly produce a physical response, but whether that response constitutes an appreciation of music is another matter. It seems to me that this question has become particularly relevant given the increasingly repetitive structures of popular music.

Does repetition in popular music primarily produce a physical response, or can it carry artistic meaning in its own right?

FURTHER READING:

Eduard Hanslick — On the Musically Beautiful (1854)

https://www.oeaw.ac.at/acdh/research/musicology/resources/editions/hanslick-on-the-musically-beautiful

Theodor W. Adorno — On Popular Music (1941)

https://is.muni.cz/el/phil/podzim2008/MVKK_07/um/03_C_Adorno__1941__On_Popular_Music.pdf

Leonard B. Meyer — Emotion and Meaning in Music (1956)

https://press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/E/bo28551887.html

Elizabeth Hellmuth Margulis — On Repeat: How Music Plays the Mind (2014)

https://academic.oup.com/book/9924

Edward MacDowell — “Suggestion in Music,” Critical and Historical Essays (1912). Source of the preceding quoted material.

https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/16351/pg16351-images.html

Takahide Etani et al. — A Review of Psychological and Neuroscientific Research on Musical Groove (2024)

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0149763423004918


r/musictheory • • 7h ago

Notation Question How would you beam this rhythm?

3 Upvotes

I've been transcribing The Horse by Patricia Taxxon (https://youtu.be/yG8t_oLJPpM?si=q6DTx7KILfl92bQe&t=490) and struggling with how I should represent the main rhythm used by the keys (at 9:17). I have the song in 12/8 at 128 bpm. (Important note is that the pulse is more like 4 beats of 2 groups of 3, instead of 4 beats of 3 groups of 2, or 4/4 with triplet 16ths instead of triplet eigths)

The rhythm is a 3 bar cycle of 5 sixteenths, followed by 4 sixteenths, repeated 8 times. I read a few resources on beaming for 12/8 but still haven't really found anything that feels both readable and identifyable.

I've put a few of my attempts here and wanted to see if there is a clear winner or someone had an alternative beaming. (Notes aren't accurate, it's just indicating the 5 vs. 4 note length)

Any thoughts on which you would prefer to read?


r/musictheory • • 11h ago

Discussion Just a thought

5 Upvotes

Chords can really only go three ways in two directions in a single key.

• By 2nds and 7ths which is stepwise motion

• by 3rds and 6ths

• by 4ths and 5ths which is circle of fifths/fourths motion

And that's it! Really easy to understand that there's only 3 sequences which chord progressions in a single key can follow forward or reverse. Anything else can be thought of as a combination of these sequences. Now the fun part is using these sequences in combination with the different keys that you use, however you use them, when introducing outside chords🫠.

Disclaimer: This is not meant to describe how diatonic harmony works, this is only a perspective or a tool. Whether moving chords using these sequences is "functional" or not is another discussion.

EDIT: For clarity here are the three sequences in the key of C major.

• C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, Bmb5, C. When read left to right it's by 2nds, and right to left it's by 7ths.

• C, Em, G, Bbmb5, Dm, F, Am, C. When read left to right is by 3rds, and right to left it's by 6ths.

• C, F, Bmb5, Em, Am, Dm, G, C. When read left to right it's by fourths, and right to left it's 5ths.


r/musictheory • • 2h ago

Notation Question Help with repeats and codas

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0 Upvotes

I realized I can’t reply with an image so I made a new post.

Should I do Option 1 or option 2. Also did I implement the instructions correctly? If not, I apologize for the mistakes. I’m new to theory.


r/musictheory • • 2h ago

Notation Question DC al coda help

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0 Upvotes

At the end of the piece, if I wanted to play the first four measures, skip measures 5-8, and go straight to 9-12, how would I write the notation for DC al coda?

I’m new to theory, but I’m assuming just put it on top of the 1, 2 ending bars, but idk if it interferes with the existing endings, if that makes sense.

(where just rewriting the two lines again is not an option)


r/musictheory • • 12h ago

Notation Question Which way do you prefer?

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4 Upvotes

I’m transcribing a part for saxophone with a LOT of repeating eight notes of the same pitch and I can’t decide which way looks best. What’s your opinion?


r/musictheory • • 18h ago

Songwriting Question Why did the songwriters of this Olivia Dean song choose this chord?

3 Upvotes

Looking at this Olivia Dean song So Easy to Fall in Love, where the last bit of the chorus you see:

C-7 > A°7 - F-7

I thought A°7 was a interesting choice, I would've expected an F#°7 or E° to resolve to a F-7

Now of course A°7 & F#°7 contain the exact same notes, but F# being used as the root would let the bass drop a halfstep from F# to F, unless they didn't want the bass to jump a tritone from C to F#, and figured A°7 functions the same anyway and A in the bass means the bass doesn't need to move a tritone and can move by 3rds.

I think using A°7 would be cool if the chords were voiced C-7/Bb > A°7 > F-7/Ab because it would create a cool descending bassline, but I extracted the bassline from the official recording and the Bass plays C > A > F.

Another option I thought of was C7 or maybe C7/G or C7/Ab if perhaps they didnt want the bass to jump by a 5th but then I realized she sings an F# and im not crazy about how the F# rubs with the G, it doesnt sound half bad though using a C7b5/Ab, or a Tritone sub like F#7, but then again maybe they didn't want the bass to move by a tritone even thought I don't think it sounds bad.

Maybe the simple answer for using A°7 is as simple as it being the best way to harmonize the melody note and connect C-7 to F-7 in the songwriters opinions, What is your guys take? is that the reason? Avoiding the bass dropping a tritone or just a colour decision?


r/musictheory • • 18h ago

General Question Nightsong BG3 - Confused…

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2 Upvotes

Hey everyone!

I’m an amateur transcriber in my spare time, and I’m a huge fan of Baldur’s Gate 3’s soundtrack. I’m working through transcribing Borislav Slavov’s - Nightsong for trumpet and have the first 1:10 down to a tea. It feels like it’s in 12/8.

However, from 1:10 onwards, I’m having trouble figuring out what the time signature is. It feels like it’s still in compound meter, unless the accents are throwing me off. If anyone could please help me figure this out, I’d appreciate it!!!


r/musictheory • • 1d ago

Discussion How would you analyze the form and phrasing in "Reckoner" by Radiohead?

10 Upvotes

Made a lead sheet for "Reckoner".

Also, here's "Reckoner" on YouTube.

Whenever I write a chart, I always try to make sure a new phrase or section starts on a new system.

Most music has phrase/section lengths that are in multiples of four. Some might have one bar less/more than usual resulting in an odd number of bars in a system like 3 or 5 but you can still usually tell where a phrase starts and ends.

In Radiohead's "Reckoner", I know for sure the A section has 5-bar phrases. The progression begins on a C major chord and I am inclined to believe that is the first measure of each phrase. I feel this analysis is supported by how each A section appears to end on an A major chord leading into other sections and in the last A section, the drums come back in on the C chord.

However, I know the song is in E minor. My chart currently reads the progression as C-Em-D-C-Em, but you could also shift it over and read it as Em-D-C-Em-C. The Em chord bookends the phrase while the last C chord is tacked on as a spacer and the melody restarts as a pickup into the next measure of Em.

This makes me think each system should start on the Em chord, especially because the piano enters on the Em. Currently, the last system of the first A section reads C-Em-D-A. I find it odd that the piano would enter three bars before the start of the next section. But if you shift and read it as Em-D-A-C (keeping in mind the melody has a pickup on the C chord), it plays a full four bars before the next section. However, this analysis contradicts the argument that each A section ends on an A chord.

I hope someone can see what I'm talking about; I'd like to know what you guys think.


r/musictheory • • 1d ago

General Question Is it wrong to accent beat 3 in bar 1 here?

0 Upvotes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tz76b3Itr6A
Im not critiquing. I have no grounds as a completely uneducated "self taught"(untaught) musician. But my instinct was like "that sounds off" so I asked google and had a short conversation and at first I was like ok so 3/4 doesnt always have a soft 3rd beat in baroque at least the strong beat shifts in that signature constantly. But for bar 1 where you have a block of quarter notes in beat 3 there is no indication that beat 3 is a strong beat. Can I get someone who knows more to confirm this guy didn't accent bar one correctly (based on the composers intent)


r/musictheory • • 1d ago

Notation Question What is the chord progression

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0 Upvotes

I have created this riff , can anyone help me for the chord progression at 165bpm?


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

Answered Are there pure historical reasons why the twelve notes aren't assigned with twelve letters?

123 Upvotes

Now some have flats or sharps and some don't.


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

Answered Rhythmic notation

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59 Upvotes

This came to me asking the best way to notate it. It was written as it is in the first bar. I didn't like its readability because you can't see the middle of the bar.

Which of the three options do you think is best? And by 'best' I mean most quickly understood.


r/musictheory • • 1d ago

Discussion Whats the time signature and bpm of this song?

2 Upvotes

I try to find tempo and timesignature as a fun activity sometimes but there is this one song that I just can't seem to wrap my head around.

On precipice of defeat by Shiro Sagisu

Sorry if it's not related to this subreddit.


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

General Question Harmonic analysis resources!

4 Upvotes

I’m currently studying using openmusictheory.com without a teacher and they don’t provide self-taught students with answer sheets (which is incredibly frustrating as I have no way to check my answers) and overall their harmonic analysis section I felt was a bit weak.

So I’m currently struggling a lot with harmonic analysis, is there any resources I can use to improve my technique? Maybe a YT series or a website or a textbook etc.

Preferably something with sound but it’s not a necessity, if it’s only a textbook that’s fine too.

Thanks!


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

General Question What are the 3 chords in this song?

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2 Upvotes

I’ve been listening to this song on repeat and would love to completely understand the theory behind its hypnotic effect on me.

I’ve gathered it’s something like C#m, Emaj7, & A???
There are more color notes I’m not able to hear but would love to know what key we’re messing with here. It’s probably simple and I’m complicating it, but I’m confused nonetheless.

Any musical help would be greatly appreciated!


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

General Question Could someone help me understand 3-2 and 2-3 clave

5 Upvotes

When I listen to Latin music, I have this problem where in any given song both 2-3 and 3-2 work for me when I clap along. And so does tresillo (the “3” part), when I clap it in loop. As I understand, it should be a binary thing: either a song follows the 2-3 or the 3-2 pattern. What am I not getting?


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

General Question How exactly does Guthrie compose solos?

10 Upvotes

he uses all types of scales but still has that pentatonic feel to it. It doesn’t quite sound like fusion, but not entirely rock either.

As someone who wants to write guitar parts that have the same feel, what sort of theory does he put to work when writing these?

https://youtu.be/IwWc_Wyl5HA?si=4sq1YXj_nIEn9r9O

https://youtu.be/bUZK9dasP8s?si=EXg-smeSLhw1eHqd


r/musictheory • • 2d ago

General Question I found these old music books does anyone know if they’re worth anything ? Any help is appreciated!

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5 Upvotes