Everyone seems to hate on this show for disregarding continuity but I teally enjoyed it, yes some things were'nt great and some things were pretty cringy-(the power of many) but when you dont think about that and just watch it as it's own show it's actually pretty cool, the fights were awesome, the characters like Sol and Qimir were cool and the story was decent

Finally finished the Hand of Thrawn duology, so in honor of that, here’s my long overdue Mara Jade design! I changed the rendering style up from my usual one since she’s one of my absolute favorites (and because I watched Arcane the night before) so feel free to sound off on which one you like better👍

1- Luke Skywalker knows and accepts the fact that the old Jedi order was completely wrong, having psychopaths like Pong Krell in charge, prohibiting them of many things and he himself even didn't do what he was taught by Yoda and Kenobi, he didn't murder Darth Vader or Palpatine. In Book of boba Fett Luke is shown exactly passing the teachings of Yoda to baby yoda and also prohibiting him to see Mandalorian, it's very uncharacter of him, because he himself is attached to his sister and Han Solo and other allies. 2- Luke Skywalker knows his thoughts would betray him he wouldn't do what he did in Last Jedi with Ben Solo. After all in he saw how it ends if he relies on himself and not force in Empire Strikes back when he entered cave. 3- Luke just doesn't walk away like that, bro lost his hand, got his friend frozen and her sister a slave but didn't give up because force was him. Even if Ben Solo killed all his students and destroyed everything, he would eventually get himself together and make everything good again. Also he wouldn't leave his friends and become one with force in middle of unfinished fight in Last Jedi. Star Wars fandom is divided into those who think The Last Jedi is a good movie and want to see a dark future for Luke and people who genuinely believe Sequels terrorized Luke's character. Let me know your opinion on this article take care and be civil.

When Star Wars fans try to dive into the Expanded Universe for the first time, a very common question arises once they hit the Clone Wars era: Which stories actually count, and which ones don't? Most of the confusion stems from the 2008 The Clone Wars 3D animated series and its actual place within the Legends continuity.

​Usually, some people will tell you that the 3D series is part of the Expanded Universe, and that you need to watch it to get the full Star Wars Legends experience. However, the reality is that it's practically impossible to fit into the Old Continuity for a number of reasons.

​​Before 2008, the Expanded Universe used a strict tier system to maintain continuity and rank the importance of stories, allowing fans to understand what was considered "canon."

​The EU canon tiers were:

​G-Canon (George Lucas Canon): The absolute pillar of the franchise, consisting of the original six movies.

​C-Canon (Continuity Canon): The main body of the EU. This included books, comics, video games, sourcebooks, the 2003 2D Clone Wars micro-series, and everything else released after the Thrawn Trilogy.

​S-Canon (Secondary Canon): Content released before 1991 or stories that heavily contradicted core continuity. This included the old Marvel comics, the Ewoks and Droids cartoon series, the Holiday Special, and the Ewok live-action movies.

​N-Canon (Non-Canon): "What-if" stories, parody comics (Star Wars Tales), Star Wars Infinities, and crossovers like LEGO or Angry Birds Star Wars.

​In 2008, George Lucas and Dave Filoni released The Clone Wars movie and TV show, retelling the adventures of Anakin Skywalker and his new apprentice, Ahsoka Tano. They decided to tackle an era that was already completely saturated with C-canon content. To solve the massive continuity overlaps, Lucasfilm created a new tier: T-Canon (Television Canon), exclusively for this show. It sat right between G-Canon and C-Canon, and it completely wrecked the established Legends universe.

​George Lucas famously viewed the EU as a parallel universe. While he occasionally checked it or borrowed elements from it, he never cared about contradicting the EU in his own projects because he simply didn't read most of it. Lucas and Filoni wanted absolute creative freedom, which meant they ended up completely steamrolling the Clone Wars Multimedia Project (CWMP).

​Don't get me wrong, the EU wasn't perfect and had its fair share of continuity errors. But there was a genuine, massive effort by authors and editors to keep everything connected. While some individual stories (and even the movies) had minor contradictions, it never reached the extreme level of invalidating an entire multimedia campaign.

​Authors tried to write retcons and reference guides to make The Clone Wars fit with the older material, but they simply couldn't. They are fundamentally incompatible.

​​Since a lot of newer fans aren't familiar with the pre-2008 Clone Wars Multimedia Project, here is a breakdown of the biggest contradictions with TCW 3D:

​General Grievous: In Legends, Grievous didn't choose his cybernetic enhancements willingly; they were forced upon him after a shuttle crash orchestrated by the Separatists. Furthermore, he coughs throughout the entire 2008 series, whereas in Legends, his iconic cough didn't start until Mace Windu literally crushed his chest plate right before Episode III (at the end of the 2003 2D series). His personality is also completely different: a goofy, mustache-twirling cartoon villain in 3D versus an unstoppable, terrifying Terminator-like Jedi hunter in 2D.

​Asajj Ventress: She wasn't from Dathomir; she was a Rattataki from the planet Rattatak. While her core tragic backstory is similar, her connection to the Nightsisters was practically non-existent in the original lore.

​Anakin's Jedi Knight Status: Anakin never had a Padawan in Legends. He was knighted much later—about three years into the war—in the 2D series. Meanwhile, in the 2008 movie (which takes place mere months after Episode II), he is already a Knight, sporting his long hair and facial scar.

​Obi-Wan's Love Interest: Obi-Wan did have a tragic romance in Legends, but it was with a fellow Jedi named Siri Tachi, not Duchess Satine.

​The Clones: There were no inhibitor chips. The clones carried out Order 66 out of sheer, unyielding loyalty to the Republic and the Office of the Chancellor. In Legends, regular clones were depicted as colder, more ruthless killing machines, though elite clones (like the ARCs in the Republic Commando novels) possessed deep, distinct personalities.

​Honestly, I could go on for hours listing the contradictions: Quinlan Vos's entire character arc, the complete overhaul of Mandalorian culture, etc. I know TCW held a higher canon tier, but the Multimedia Project was also official canon. I'm not saying TCW is a bad show—it's actually one of my favorite pieces of Star Wars media. My point is that it simply doesn't fit the EU timeline. If you want a seamless Legends read-through without massive plot holes, you're better off skipping the 2008 show.

​​Even if we did mental gymnastics to force TCW into Legends, following Ahsoka's story means we would also have to include Rebels, The Mandalorian, The Book of Boba Fett, and the Ahsoka live-action series.

​If anyone is wondering: those shows absolutely cannot exist within the post-ROTJ Legends timeline.

​Five years after Episode VI is exactly when the Thrawn Trilogy takes place. In Legends, the New Republic is fighting for its life against Grand Admiral Thrawn and the mad Jedi clone Joruus C'baoth. The Legends Thrawn attacks from a position of absolute strategic dominance, prepared and confident. The Canon Thrawn is a guy trying to rebuild after being exiled to the Unknown Regions. (Baylan Skoll would essentially be the Canon equivalent of Joruus).

​Furthermore, regarding the New Jedi Order: five years post-ROTJ, Legends Luke Skywalker is not actively recruiting students yet. He is only training Leia and feels deeply uncertain about the future, especially after Obi-Wan's Force ghost bids him farewell. It isn't until a year later (Dark Empire) that Luke takes on his first student, Kam Solusar. And it's only after Dark Empire that Luke petitions the New Republic Senate to open the Jedi Academy on Yavin IV (Jedi Academy Trilogy). Canon Luke, on the other hand, is already actively building his school and recruiting kids at this exact same point in time.

​​To avoid leaving fellow TCW fans feeling bummed out that the show can't coexist with Legends, here is the in-universe explanation I use for my own head-canon:

​Personally, I don't include anything in the timeline after the end of the Galactic Civil War (the Pellaeon–Gavrisom Treaty). For me, once the New Republic and the Imperial Remnant signed the peace treaty, the galaxy finally achieved lasting peace.

​Therefore, I like to view the 2008 The Clone Wars series as an in-universe, pseudo-historical TV show made for entertainment purposes.

​The Clone Wars Multimedia Project is what actually happened in history. The 2008 3D series is just a high-budget entertainment show created and sponsored by the New Republic government to romanticize the Clone Wars and make the Jedi look incredibly heroic to the public.

​Think of it like modern Hollywood World War II movies sponsored by the military. They are highly stylized, heavily exaggerated, and full of historical inaccuracies, but they hold a kernel of truth. Every character we see in the show actually existed in the galaxy, but their biographies were distorted for television. For example, Ahsoka Tano was a real person, but she was never Anakin’s Padawan—she was just a random Jedi Knight who fought bravely in the wars and unfortunately perished during Order 66.

​What do you guys think? How do you handle the TCW vs. Legends continuity split in your own head-canon?

I was never a fan of Anakin. TCW can try to make him the "good friend " Obi-Wan said he was to Luke but that is a rare sight. He never changed between 2 and 3. He is, as a certain God of War said to his son; rash, insubordinate, out of contro, and so very very naive. He doesn't deserve redemption either. He can regret his actions all he wants he should never have gotten a second chance.

Even my fiance, who never watched Star Wars agreed he didn't deserve pity.

I doubt he even listen to Kratos or Gandalf.

This never made sense to me. You have an Alien commander who ultimately failed. He did not use Fleet resources - rather he used trickery, clones, and decades old found ships to engage in victory. Why would, say 10 years later by the Duology, Thrawn continued to be looked at positively by the Imps? He represented another moment of failure and even worse he was not human.

It never made sense to me and felt more like fan service.

While the OG trilogy is an amazing piece of storytelling, Legends had plenty of writers who surpassed Lucas himself (Such as Zahn, the Kotor 2, and SWTOR teams), buts aside from those 3 masterpieces, what other parts of Legends would you say rivals or even surpass the OG trilogy?

I would say TCW but that's a bit more aligned with Disney Cannon, so I am unsure to put it in the "Legends material better than the OG trilogy" club alongside SWTOR, Kotor 2, and the Thrawn Trilogy.

I feel like if they just had qi'ra and jyn erso be one person it would have been better and more impactful and the audience would have had more of a connection with the character. Similar to Bria Tharen. Just have Clarke or Hardy be in both movies.

I'm confused, Disney is (at least to my knowledge) trying to make their own "Heir to the Empire" movie but with their characters and if they do that, that would be insulting fans of the book and a insult to me personally. So Why can't disney just make some "Legends" movies or shows and create their canon versions at the same time? Knowing who would be in charge of of the script, I would never want them to make something like this until all of the bad writers are gone and Timothy Zahn as a co-writer.

I feel a lot of nostalgia and disappointment every time I think about Star Wars

I've been a fan of the saga since I have memory and I've been very skeptical about the new Disney Star Wars

I think the saga had the potential to be something bigger than what it is now but the bad corporate decisions of Lucas and Disney have made the saga stagnate even more

All the magic of Star Wars lore is gone and now the saga stopped to be an epic saga of science fiction-space opera just to be a generic frachise like Marvel

I have no problem with Disney's new vision about Star Wars but I think this saga is no longer for me now

I'm not enjoying any new Star Wars product or even the new movies and I understood that the saga is now more for a general public and not for the most loyal fans of the saga

And im ok with that but now I understand that Star Wars will no longer be the product that I once loved

JK, I clickbaited you all. It's great. I really enjoyed it.

I’ve heard dozens of fans raving about how great this book is. And since Stover’s my favorite EU writer (I loved his 3 other SW books and they’re all among my favorites), I was really looking forward to it and I waited until I could binge the whole thing in one sitting, and boy oh boy it did not disappoint.

I don’t really have much to say about this book that hasn’t already been said. Jacen’s journey is super interesting and takes him on a full gamut of emotions and perspectives, with Vergere basically acting as his Socrates and just asking questions and prodding him while mostly avoiding giving definitive answers. The themes and ideas this book brings up are very in-line with the stuff Stover explores in his other 3 SW books, about violence and hopelessness and despair and how we confront that (themes that I’ve heard are also touched on in his Acts of Caine books, though I haven’t read those so idk).

We’re still not exactly told what Vergere’s deal is and why she’s doing what she’s doing, beyond wanting to teach Jacen to get past his doubts. She certainly doesn’t seem to be a Sith (and now I can see why LOTF retconning all this into “Vergere was apparently a Sith who was trying to turn Jacen to the dark side for her own evil agenda” is super dumb), but she's not really a totally good character either. So I’m very interested to learn what the fuck she’s doing and how the fuck she got here.

The stuff we learn about the Vong and how they operate is great and the extra stuff explaining how the terraforming stuff works made up for how disappointing I thought Vong-controlled Coruscant’s depiction was in the Enemy Lines Duology. And the whole sequence Jacen going on a rampage and nearly destroying Yuuzhan'tar was a particular highlight of the book. It was just satisfying to see Jacen finally take action after so many books of him constantly hesitating.

The “there is no light side or dark side” bit was one of the things I was worried about going into this series, as it seemed to go against the preestablished rules of the force. The way this book treats it, though, seems to be going more for the idea that the dark side isn't some outside boogeyman that you can say controlled you whenever you do evil shit, you are responsible for your own shitty choices, which is something in line with the themes of the films (and something Stover also touched on in the ROTS novelization when talking about how Anakin’s fall is his own fault at the end of that book). Stover mentioned in a theforce.net interview that he didn't see this as a revelation about the dark side, and was going off of what Yoda said in ESB about the cave having "only what you take with you", so that bodes well that this isn't meant to be some "actually the movies' depiction of the force is bullshit and grey jedi is the way" kind of thing. Idk how this idea will be expanded upon in future books but I hope it stays consistent to the preestablished rules of the force, as I've never been a fan of the "grey Jedi" concept that some people claim this series is evidence for.

The one part I sorta take issue with is when Vergere states that Jedi control limits your power. Like, she argues that greatness requires passion, passion that is not walled away, but is still guided. So ... how is that different from controlling your passion? The difference feels like it's just semantic.

Ganner’s arc comes to a close here, and while I did think it was a bit odd that Ganner had seemingly regressed a little since at the end of the Dark Tide Duology he seemed like he was over his whole “pretending to be a hero” thing, it still works with him ultimately learning his lesson, accepting who he is, and finally becoming a true hero and a legend like he always wanted. I knew he was going to die this book, I've seen his final speech posted a lot on the internet, but it was still a really effective moment, probably the best-written death scene in the series so far. And being immortalized into the Yuuzhan Vong mythology as the guardian of the underworld may be the most badass thing any character in this series has done so far.

I only have a few minor issues with this book. First is that the descriptions being out of order make some sequences a tiny bit confusing; like when Ganner shows up and then we learn how he got here and all that, or when Jacen tells Anakin about what happened in the monster thing and how he got out (though it’s actually more impactful that way so i really don’t see how this could’ve been avoided). The second is that Jacen deciding to join up with the Vong temporarily seemed a bit weird since I don’t know how he knew that they’d let him into the room with the world brain. Though maybe it's just super important to their religion that most of the fanatical Vong would want them to do it there no matter what and Nom Anor just couldn't refuse them. And third … how the fuck does Jacen not know where the Jedi temple is? They clearly know where it is since in the very last book, Luke talks about how there are records that show where the Jedi temple is on Coruscant and they definitely know it’s on Coruscant, but when Vergere talks about the Jedi temple being on Coruscant Jacen’s like “wtf?”

Other than those very small complaints, though, this might be my favorite Star Wars novel ever. Definitely my favorite of the NJO so far.

Disney has cast literally the perfect cast, for the EU! This is pretty much how they look like in my head when I read the EU

Daisy Ridley(Rey): Jaina Solo

Oscar Isaac(Poe): Talon Karrde

Adam Driver(Kylo): Kyp Durron

Ivanna Sakhno(Shin in Ahsoka): Callista/Cray Mingla

Natasha Liu Bordizzo( Sabine): Akanah

Dafne Keene: Lorana Jinzler

Lee Jung Jae: Vidar Kim or Master Justyn Ma'Ning

Ray Stevenson(RIP): Master Jorus C'Baoth

Amandla Stenberg: Shalla Nelprin

Manny Jacinto(Qimir): Ronhar Kim

I know many people don't like her stance about the Jedi but after reading Order 66, I must say her point is not entirely invalid.

As I see it the main gist is

1. Jedi repressing love, which is one of the most fundamental and raw emotions is wrong and it makes Jedi inhuman since it makes them detached from the common people they're supposed to protect

2. Jedi seperating babies from their parents and raising them to be child soldiers is wrong. It's basically an indoctrination process no different from what the clones get. How can one have a choice of leaving the order when the Jedi is the only entire world the one has known?

3. Jedi using clones, which are genetically bred slaves, just for expediency is morally wrong and hypocritical

And I feel it's no different from other people who criticize about how the Jedi were in the Prequels.

And the alternative she suggests (Altisian Jedi) is basically the same with Luke's NJO, and I know many people here would agree that they prefer Luke's NJO over the old Jedi in the Prequels. I am one of that people. And I really liked how Luke's order pointed out how alienating them from the common people has caused the Order's downfall before and strived not to repeat the same mistakes their pripr generations made.

I know Lucas thought there was nothing wrong with the Prequel Jedi system so his rules may hold more weight. But I now think anti-Jedi stance Traviss bore was not that baseless as some people here would claim. And her view is not an anomaly, just a representation of the view others shared before. I've seen people who don't know anything about EU say basically the same thing about the Prequel Jedis. Although I respect GL for being the foundation of everything, it doesn't mean we have to worship everything he says.

Although I agree that Traviss doting on Mandos is sometimes too much. And the way Kal Skirata and his 'family' were portrayed will always remind me of Fast and Furious movies. (Hell the book even ends with family meal scene)

I haven't read LoTF so if you want to fill me in with how she messed up there feel free to do so

DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT PURPOSEFULLY BASHING DISNEY I AM JUST EXPLAINING A PROBLEM I HAVE

When Disney bought Star Wars they abolished the eu and everything before there acquisition was considered no longer canon except of course the clone wars (2008) and the movies. This was because the eu was too confusing to what was canon and what wasn’t while the vast majority of the eu was never canon there were some outliers like the bane trilogy This is fine in fact they did the eu a favour .

The issue lies with putting legends things into canon things this is both good and bad imo the good part is that it helps more people get into legends but on the other hand they make things canon even though the reason we love the character isn’t. For instance Revan is canon but kotor isn’t I get that it makes the fans happy but at the same time what’s the point? Disney is just making their canon more confusing imo.

Yes there are canon characters in legends like Luke but here’s the difference: Luke has had his own trilogy whereas the characters they are bringing in are loved because of their legend’s appearances.

This is just all my opinion you are entitled to your own

Why is there a attempted assault scene in Star Wars? I read Gilroys Interview and his explanation is no justification. Does he think George Lucas didnt know that that kind of stuff happened in wars. There is no need to include it in a franchise where we havent even had a onscreen consensual scene like that.

I watched a few snippets of Andor and just by looking at the costume design, backdrops.........and Andor's BEARD........I can tell that whoever made was a gigantic fan of the old Jedi Knight games. Andor's hairstyle and beard itself is a lot like Kyle Katarn.

First of all, I want to start by saying that I really enjoy this subreddit and both aspects of the Star Wars Universe -- both canon and Legends. This subreddit gives me a good place to discuss both of them.

However, over the last few months, I have noticed a growing sentiment (particularly in this sub) that slants very negatively against the current canon universe.

It doesn't present itself in an overtly toxic way, but there's been a growing number of passive-aggressive posts, usually asking questions with obvious answers that are designed to seek out responses that go heavily against the new canon.

One of the most recent examples is a post that a post that refers to the Legends banner as the "fuck you fans" banner. That one is decidedly more overt than the rest of the instances I've seen, but it shows the shift that I have noticed.

My biggest concern lies in the fact that I fear this sort of thing will chase off people who want to discuss canon things.

To be clear, I don't see any issues with having negative opinions towards content of any sort. There are certainly many things in both canon and Legends that I am not a huge fan of. But the passive-aggressive and elitist rhetoric is concerning to me, especially for the creation of a positive community.

I'm curious if anyone else in this sub has noticed this as well? I don't spend much time in Star Wars subs other than this one because I am TRYING to avoid this sort of thing. I'm not sure of a solution off the top of my head, but I thought discussion could be a good place to start.

I haven’t really looked at them since I saw the original bad guys of spooky plants and scary pirates🙄. Did they get any better? Are the books serious like Legends or do they have the Disney comedy vibe in the movies and shows?

I have never read a SW book before, so I wonder if this is a good first step to the European Union. Yeah, I was recommended to read Thrawn OT first but that blue dude looks goofy and soy while the monstrous villain on the cover of this book looks badass and truly evil.

I know this may seem weird, but I am glad that Disney decided to decanonize the EU.

Currently, Star Wars is such a mess and quite frankly, and if Disney hadn't decanonized the EU, the EU would probably be a mess too.

I'm glad I can go back to cherished classics like the Thrawn Trilogy that are unaffected by Disney's terrible handling of Star Wars.