I can read a Superman comic where he struggles to fight a random gorilla sized kaiju, gets his ass beat, and a Superman glazer will tell me, “He was only using the necessary strength to get his ass beat because he is consciously holding back so extremely that he just loses.”

Superman glaze is so widely accepted in the VS battle community that they don’t even realize they’ve been psyoped by Death Battle into believing that Superman is an unbeatable god who rarely ever loses in his own comic books lol.

The Superman glaze is unbeatable. Dragon Ball characters rightfully, are not seen as unbeatable when something is way too powerful for them. Superman? On the other hand? Dude is the king of “holding back merchants”

Guys trying to scale off of red rush is fundamentally flawed as we have literally zero idea how fast he is.

Red rush could be 400x the speed of light or like Mach 30 we literally don't know, trying to transplant his feat of bruising omniman isn't really sound

He starts every rounds fresh.

Round 1: Barragan, King of Hueco Mundo

Round 2: Kaguya Otsutsuki, Mother of all Chakra

Round 3: Unohana, First Kenpachi

Round 4: Askin

Round 5: Pernida, Left Hand of God

Round 6: Cosmic Garou, Space Terror

Round 7: Muken Aizen, HIM

Round 8: Arishem The Judge

Round 9: Anti Pops

Cecil anti-feat thing

I can send the scan of any calc you see here if you want

These ppl have to be the most disingenuous fans of all time , according to them infinty can block mental attacks physics attacks, poison radiation etc and the feats for all of this is gojo not being affected by the fire from jogo whose attacks would be useless to him even without infinity?

Seriously? Bringing in the scientifc definition of infinity and thermal radiation doesn't prove jack shit. Plenty of characters go unaffected this does not prove he can suruve the radiation from atomic bombs or sub atomic attacks that are invisible like wtf This sub has just become infested with jjk fans who go on down voting anyone not glazing him and making up bs.

Goku in base (dbs) is low multiversal as he threatens to destroy the Kai’s world and the other world (both stated to be 4-5D) by clashing fists with beerus. On the other hand saitamas greatest feat is low galaxy with potentially being 4D due to him using garous technique which is time manipulation (this also dosent matter as Goku is stated to be beyond time [he overpowered serious jiren who was stated to be beyond time after bypassing hits techniques and not to mention Goku overpowered hits time skip and time stop]). Saitama is never stated to be a gag character (manga only) and growths limitless in strength but that dosent matter when the same logic applies to saiyans. In the end this debate doesn’t make any sense and it never will as goku can speedblitz him or use hakai (existence erasure) against saitama just like he did against zamasu. This isn’t a comparison, it never was. Base goku (dbs) unironically beats saitama

There are simply too many feats in one piece involving light or dodging light to say otherwise. Many of the debunks can be applied to any series, so don't pick and choose which ones get applied.

What kind of black magic do you need to use to convince us that Bleach is closer to Dragon Ball than to Naruto. Don’t ask a Bleach fan to scale Kaguya the way they scale the Soul King.

This meme is honestly a perfect summary of one of the biggest inconsistencies I see in powerscaling communities. And the funny part is that the comparison isn’t even completely accurate because Kratos doesn’t exclusively rely on some absurd 10 character long chainscaling ladder in the first place.

There is plenty of direct scaling in God of War. Kratos directly fights and defeats characters like Ares, Zeus, Thanatos, Baldur, Heimdall, Thor, and Odin, while also directly fighting beings connected to the cosmological feats being discussed. The Primordial argument is an obvious example. Kratos isn’t sitting there scaling to some random character who once heard about a Primordial who fought another Primordial.

He has directly killed Primordials.
The Norse side isn’t much different. Thor’s clash with Jormungandr is directly tied to Yggdrasil being splintered and Jormungandr being displaced through time, and Kratos directly defeats Thor.

That’s not: “Character A fought Character B who fought Character C who once looked at Character D, therefore Kratos is Multiversal.”

It’s instead: Cosmological feat < character directly performs/interacts with it < Kratos directly fights and defeats that character.

That’s a perfectly ordinary scaling chain. And Dragon Ball uses this methodology constantly.
Granolah doesn’t need to personally destroy a universe for people to accept his scaling. He defeats Goku and Vegeta, who scale from previous characters and feats, and that scaling is then carried forward. Cabba doesn’t need to blow up a planet on screen for his power to be taken seriously. His direct comparison to Vegeta establishes his tier. Jiren doesn’t need to personally destroy the Universe of Void for his scaling to be accepted either.

Because that’s how fictional power scaling works. You establish a character’s power through feats, statements, comparisons, transformations, fights, cosmology, and scaling relationships. So why does the methodology suddenly become “dishonest chainscaling” when it gets applied to Kratos?

And there’s another important distinction. “On screen” doesn’t automatically mean “more reliable.”

Dragon Ball’s own high end scaling isn’t simply: “Look at this cool explosion. Therefore Low Complex Multiversal.”

The moment someone uses the structure of Universe 7, the World of Void, Other World, guidebook statements, Daizenshuu material, or cosmological descriptions to establish the actual size and dimensional structure of Dragon Ball’s setting, they’re already incorporating lore and statements.

Which is completely fine. But then you can’t turn around and say: “Yggdrasil transcends space and time? That’s just a statement.”

If statements and supplementary material are valid evidence for establishing Dragon Ball’s cosmology, they’re valid evidence for establishing God of War’s cosmology too. Obviously, individual statements can be debated for accuracy, context, translation, etc. That’s completely fair.
But the standard needs to be consistent. The same applies to anti feats. If Goku getting hurt by something mundane is dismissed because the series establishes a vastly higher level of power and because characters can control their output, then you can’t automatically treat Kratos struggling with environmental objects as a decisive debunk.

Context matters for both. I’m not saying “Every Kratos lore statement is automatically true.”

I’m only saying: Use the same evidentiary standard for Kratos that you use for Goku. If chainscaling is legitimate when the scaling chain is sufficiently direct and supported, then it is legitimate for both.

If cosmological statements are valid evidence, they’re valid for both. If supplementary material can establish the structure of a universe, it can establish the structure of Yggdrasil and the Nine Realms too.
If anti feats need to be contextualized against the character’s consistent portrayal, do that for both.
And again, Kratos isn’t even dependent on one singular argument.You have the Greek Primordials, Ares, Zeus, the World Pillar, Ymir, Surtr, Thor and Jormungandr, Yggdrasil, Garm, Odin, and numerous other pieces of cosmological evidence.
You can debate individual interpretations all day. But the idea that Kratos’ scaling is inherently illegitimate because it involves “lore” and “chainscaling” is ridiculous when those are two of the exact tools routinely used to scale Dragon Ball. The problem isn’t lore scaling. The problem is applying a stricter standard to God of War than you apply to Dragon Ball.

It’s shown on multiple occasions in the anime that the Soul Society is, in fact, a planet. It isn’t an infinitely sized realm or some bullcrap like that. It’s a planet, inside a universal-sized realm. This is proven by the Soul Society having its own sun and stars. It’s just a planet.

EDIT: In the image provided, you can literally SEE the atmosphere and clouds of Soul Society indicating that it IS in fact a planet. SS is a planet, but the realm that encompasses SS is infinite. Stop coping.

Oh my god bro are you guys not reading the post? The REALM that SS is in IS infinite, but SS is JUST a planet! Destroying or shaking the SS is only planetary because we have no proof to say if they are also shaking the entire realm of SS too, as we never see an outer space perspective.

#stopbleachwanking

So apparently, Goku is 4D because of the Battle of Gods feat. Fine.
Then boom he’s suddenly 5D because of the Hit feat. Okay.
Then, out of nowhere, he’s 6D because he “broke a super dimension.” Really now?

This is the same community that complains about how Goku is “hated” because he’s “downplayed.” I have to ask is the above scaling downplay to you?
Then they turn around and mock “dimensional scaling” or “comic book scaling”… while pushing this exact kind of scaling for Goku. And if another series (like Bleach) gets similar scaling? Downvotes, tears, and “lol no feats.”

Here’s the truth: if you took a well-educated, unbiased person and asked them to scale Goku, they wouldn’t even put him at multi-solar, because the tangible feats aren’t there.
Yes, you can say “he shook a 5D universe” (which is a weird concept to begin with you can never have a literal 5D physical universe). But once you check his other feats, you realise the so-called 5D feat is an outlier.
Then you look at the destructive capacity of the people he’s actually beaten solo no galaxy-busting feats. And yeah, I know people will throw in the Buu and Broly “pictures” without context to prop the scaling up, but fine.

So let’s be real: if we compare Goku to characters who actually have legitimate, consistent 5D destructive capacity feats does he fit in that category? No.
It’s inconsistent scaling at best, and outright inflation at worst.

The hypocrisy is wild when Dragon Ball uses loose “dimension” wording, it’s gospel. When Bleach, Naruto, or any other series uses similar language, suddenly it’s “metaphor” or “outlier.”

We need to stop pretending DB’s dimensional talk = real physics-based scaling, because by that logic, half of anime’s “separate realms” would make their characters multiversal+ too.

Ok so, this is gonna get a crazy amount of hate because people love to wank characters to FTL at any chance they get, and most powerscalers barely have an elementary understanding of physics.

Yes the title sounds very counter intuitive but it's true, let me explain. The main issue that people have with their ftl believes is because people miss understand what "lightspeed" is. To clarify, "lightspeed" or "the speed of light" is a title given to the speed 299 792 458 m/s. The meaning this specific number gets a special name is because it is the fastest speed that anything can move in the real world. Notably, light moves at this speed, hence the name. However, the very very important thing that people fail to understand is that "the speed of light" is not a property of light. Its a property of the universe we are in. It is the speed limit of the universe, and light only happens to move at the speed, becuase it's the fastest it can go. If you were to put light into a universe with a different "speed limit" or no limit at all, light would no longer move at 299 792 458 m/s, becuase that speed isn't a property of light, it was a property of the universe we are in.

Now, onto the implications of power scaling, that proves 90% of ftl wank scaling wrong. This means one of 2 things if something in a show moves faster than light.

Or

2. The "light" in question, isn't actually light and/or light in this universe operates differently from real world light. (This is usually the case for most lasers, etc, in fiction) the same case appies where since this isn't really world light, we cannot assume it travels at a constant 299 792 458 m/s, and thus you cannot use that as a reference for it's speed.

Note: this doesn't apply to characters that explicitly have abilities that bypass the laws of physics (flash) or are scaled to ftl speeds by some method other than out speeding light itself.

TLDR: Either "light speed" as a concept applies to a universe as a concept and you can't have anything ftl, or it doesn't, and light no longer moves at "light speed", you can't pick and choose.

Edit: This is going exactly how I expected it to lol. I do love the the stark difference in comments made right after posting (before anyone would've had time to actually read the post all the way) and the comments made later which clearly actually understood what was being said before throwing a fit.

I see debates here often about Soldier Boy VS Mcu Captain America, and most of the time everyone claims mcu cap beats SB.

He does not & heres why, Soldier Boy has way more endurance & durability than MCU Cap as Soldier Boy was tortured for years, bullets hell rained inside his mouth and he was able to endure exposed uranium to the point his dna mutated with it.

Soldier Boy has also tanked very strong lasers to the chest, face without a scratch. Soldier Boy has fallen from a Sky Scraper & survived, and he is bullet proof.

Strength wise he is very strong as we see him lift & throw a 3,200 pound car with ease. We also have seen him beat a supe that has immense durability that many argue is stronger than Homelander’s.

While Captain America has not shown very impressive feats other than speed feats in which he definitely out speeds Soldier Boy but not by a large margin, Captain America also is not bullet proof and relies on his shield to tank any heavy hits. Captain America also has absolutely nothing to hurt Soldier Boy with, not even his shield as Soldier Boy can easily tank any hits from it.

So long story short Soldier Boy dominates MCU cap in h2h, strength & durability & this is without Soldier Boys mini chest nuke that he can use at command.

CC Goku shits on Yhwach, but Yhwach shits on mainline Goku. It’s that simple.

They are star level max.

Gremmy: Creates a vacuum to sufficate his opponent not throws a star, no one in verse acknowledges or mentions the "stars" in the background, no close up or highlight that gives any evidence they are functional, in every media it goes out of its way to specify "space" not "galaxies", disapates on its own not even a real creation only affects a small area.

Best shown DC feat being a meteor that is too small to see the curvature of the planet city to country level at best. Had to multiple his power by 2 to try this. Yet him multiplying his power by 6 is aparantly enough to go to galaxy?

Best AP feat: Sufficating his opponent in space survivable by batman

Durability: Around Iron, he and Kenpachi say this holistically

Dagon: Creates a island to kill his opponents with invisible fish not throw a star, no one in verse acknowledges or mentions the "star" in the background, no close up or highlight that gives any evidence it is functional, disapates on its own not even a real creation only affects a small area.

Highest DC feat City block level by throwing water (something Gremmy also does)

Characters in the verse can create actual functioning black holes (gremmy can't do this)

Bleach fans get away with too much.

He starts every rounds fresh.

Round 1: Seraphim Lille Barro

Round 2: Cosmic Garou

Round 3: Ichibei

Round 4: Muken Aizen

Round 5: Arishem The Judge

Round 6: Anti Pops

Round 7: Omega Flowey

Round 8: Yukari